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Just for you, Grumpf
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RS400atC View Drop Down
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Posts: 3011 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Just for you, Grumpf
    Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 2:37pm
Good point about making trapeze helming optional. Some people do that with the RS800. At the moment I see helming from the wire as a skill to develop, mostly to enable me to drop into other boats now and then. I'm getting to the age where if I don't get competent on a wire soon, it won't happen! And the occassional blast on an 800 is worth the learning curve. I prefer the 800 for a two mile blast across open water, but I'm happy hiking the 400 for harbour races.
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Smight at BBSC View Drop Down
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Posts: 1129 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Smight at BBSC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 3:55pm
Originally posted by G.R.F.

What I want to do is go to a single hander with both options.

I.E has the rack to operate with, but offers the option of entry level wiring
but without the absolute necessity to wire inorder to survive round a
course.

To me a wire I consider like a harness, use it or not but it's a comfort
option rather than a necessity for the thing to function.

So I'd like to be able to get round courses without having to have it, but if
the need arose and I got fed up with all that stomach aching hiking
bollox, I just clip in and get a bit of support, maybe hike out a bit further
off the rack.

Now, what is so wrong with that?

Why has it got to be either or?

A higly marketable product I would have thought, it could be used inland
or on the sea, introduce folk to harnesses if they want, but not an
absolute necessity.


Usually boats with a wire have more sail area or a more powerful rig setup to warrant the extra need for more leverage. Otherwise you end up with a compromise between the two ....
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Inland sea View Drop Down
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Posts: 290 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Inland sea Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 4:54pm

So what is it we are trying to achieve here?

Do we want a Musto that you can Hike or are we after a Vario that will go upwind?

Looking at the fastest SMOD hiker (IMHO) you can only really carry about 10m of upwind sail efficiently.

Probably a jib to keep the COE low and the power as high as possible

You don't want a blade kite as it becomes to edgy downwind but you want it just flat enough to be able to reach with in the medium stuff so you can make the apparent start to work.

Big Enough to be fun but not so large that it makes the boat a pain to sail so about 12m

Flat enough at the back to give a stable hoist and dowse

Enough automatic rig control to make it easier to sail in gusty conditions

Not too fine a bow that it wants to resemble a submarine at the first sign of muppetry

Light so it gives you the real sensation of speed

Wide enough to make upwind planing a possibility

Sensible size foils so it isn't a twitchathon when you get planing

Nice open question ... Is all of this achievable?

edit

Agree TT looks nice Peaky 



Edited by Inland sea
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Guests View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 4:56pm
Don't mind me TT, I'm not fishing for compliments. But hey, give me a cheque and I'll build it for you.  You could race Grumpf
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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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Posts: 4028 		Post Options Post Options   Quote G.R.F. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 7:11pm
Originally posted by turnturtle


Surely in reality using a harness on a board isn't optional either Graeme?
Not once you're in the wind strength to support it- just like a dinghy
trapeze then?



No it's very much an option, back in the day, I was always faster out of
the harness, you just use it to rest. Even now, I stay out of it for the first
few hundred yards of the beat out of the gun and only hook in for
shortish periods mid beat. Probably why I have this mindset.



Originally posted by Inland sea

<FONT face=Helv size=2>

So what is it we are trying to achieve here?


Do we want a Musto that you can Hike or are we after a Vario that will
go upwind?


 




Bit of both I guess, with the additional features, a Musto that wont
pitchpole if it hits a ripple. A Vario that will live with a Contender upwind
and stay with the Musto off wind..

Whatever the wind strength.

Not much to ask.

Oh and Red with black straps, studs matt black metal work, carbon wings
Orbit blocks, supported leading edge mast head spinnaker, alto style
swivel pole, centreboard, kick up plate and rudder I wouldn't say no to a T
foil if it was felt necessary.

Nearest thing still keeps coming up Frankenblaze.
https://www.ease-distribution.com/
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blaze720 View Drop Down
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Posts: 1635 		Post Options Post Options   Quote blaze720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 7:37pm

FrankenHalo anyone ?

 
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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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Posts: 4028 		Post Options Post Options   Quote G.R.F. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 7:44pm
Originally posted by blaze720

FrankenHalo anyone ?


 



Only if you agree it needs a bigger centreboard and i can have my swinging
pole and a mast head spinnaker and an optional trap for light weights, make
the lard boys hike
https://www.ease-distribution.com/
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Villan View Drop Down
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Posts: 1768 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Villan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 8:07pm
FrankenHaloVareoBlaze Performance Skiff?
Vareo - 149 "Secrets"
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blaze720 View Drop Down
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Posts: 1635 		Post Options Post Options   Quote blaze720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Apr 09 at 8:09pm

.... er .. and if you weight 100kg first !   

 
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timnoyce View Drop Down
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Posts: 1991 		Post Options Post Options   Quote timnoyce Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 09 at 9:06am
I think that we need to agree on some basic ground rules... length, beam, sail area etc. and then start a new class. A PROPER open development class. Even if it's only in theory it could be an interesting project to see what people come up with.

Peaky's boat looks cool, I like it. My fear with the Halo is that with a minimum crew weight of 100kg and a hull weight of 70+ kg you have some massive weight factors before you even start which is surely going to affect the performance massively. I heard a rumour that 10kg of weight is roughly equal to 30 handicap points round a course (not sure how this was worked out but sounds about right)

I'm thinking the boat will need to look like a hiking SK4. Very pointy, very narrow on the waterline and very wide racks... with a t-foil at the back.
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