Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Another club closure |
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CT249 ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 08 Jul 06 Online Status: Offline Posts: 399 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 26 May 22 at 2:46am |
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The concept's being called "innovation overshoot" by some. As they say, "Sports, in particular equipment-based, “lifestyle” sports can experience a rapid rise in popularity but eventually technology-driven competition leads to equipment overshooting the capabilities and financial budgets of users. This ‘innovation overshoot’ leads to a decline in participation and the eventual collapse of the market for the sport’s equipment." The research I have done confirms that yes, many clinker/carvel dinghy owners were very disparaging about the boxy plywood boats, and of one designs in general. Reading Beecher Moore's accounts, the snobbery was such that many of the ply-boat owners went out and formed their own clubs on waterways that had not previously been used for sailing, so in some ways the snobbery could have been a good thing. It's hard to find a positive side in the current snobbery towards "mainstream" boats we often see. The weird thing is that the hype about hyperperformance continues even though they have been around for a couple of decades now and still not one such boat class has achieved real popularity. Never has reality been ignored by so long by so many.
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turnturtle ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 05 Dec 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2538 |
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Sounds great Duncan, I do hope the shine wasn't taken off when that ‘finishing second’ was pushed through the spreadsheet of pointlessness … Anyway, that sounds like a nicer evening than catching up on work, albeit after a day in the saddle finding this place: ![]() I guess there are some perks to modern, post Covid working practices … not as many being retired though ![]() Edited by turnturtle - 26 May 22 at 7:17am |
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Grumpycat ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 29 Sep 20 Online Status: Offline Posts: 497 |
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You forget, as always , we sail PURSUITS . So all the spreadsheet work is done before the race ![]() I caught and got past the past the slow boats easily but spent too long having a very enjoyable dice with a well sailed Aero 7 to be able to challenge the winning Supernova, sailed by one of the best sailors in the club. Still loving the D-zero by the way, it works over a range of conditions, it’s surprisingly comfortable and the sailing experience/feedback is sublime. Stunning picture tt, shame I don’t have the right to live in that country anymore .
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turnturtle ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 05 Dec 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2538 |
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Glad to hear the D-Zero is still good fun - totally agree about its versatility, and you're right, I forgot you sailed pursuits. I guess slower boats getter better value for their money then???
I have thought several times about buying a DZ out here, but something always seems to take priority - plus there's no racing for them, which would probably feel a bit frustrating after a while. As for your rights... they are what you make them, no one has been kicked out, but a few have decided to leave because they refused to pay taxes or declare their income, therefore can't live in the grey zone anymore.
Edited by turnturtle - 26 May 22 at 12:19pm |
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NicolaJayne ![]() Posting king ![]() Joined: 01 Mar 19 Online Status: Offline Posts: 109 |
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The best teacher is not necessarily the best practitioner
aso the best of the best coaoching might be beneficial to squeeze that last hundredth out of something but when your progress is is to get from 60 % into the 90s % |
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NicolaJayne ![]() Posting king ![]() Joined: 01 Mar 19 Online Status: Offline Posts: 109 |
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and hence the reason at least one of the more voluminous and controversial posters seems to be on some kind of approval of their posts, to make sure they aren't being as overtly egregious in their misogyny, homophobia and transphobia as they have been in the past.
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maxibuddah ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 06 Mar 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1760 |
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I see snobbery mentioned in a few posts recently relating to boats, construction methods, etc. I think that isn't the case so much these days but reading many posts on here it is still alive and kicking, except these days its aimed at the fleet racing/handicap racing systems. So damn what if all you've got is handicap racing, its still fun, its being out on the water, having a race around with your friends. The 'spreadsheet of pointlessness' is a particular disparaging remark Jimbo. I don't care theres a program there to work it out afterwards, I've enjoyed the sail (possibly). Gives me something to moan about PY bandits afterwards ;)
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Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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turnturtle ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 05 Dec 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2538 |
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I see your point - being out on the water chasing around with mates - sounds good, why not do it in not too dissimilar craft that you each prefer to sail if it's really not that serious- race them scratch, the way God intended. Even the most ardent PY aficionado is NOT seriously suggesting a Musto Skiff vs an Oppy of similar skilled sailing are ‘really racing' in the conventional sense in one isolated race. At best the PY system works on averages to score a series between these two ends of the spectrum... even then it requires local correction to suit water type and prevailing conditions to optimise it, which many committees are reluctant to do So back to your evening out of competitive cruising, someone comes along to rank you afterwards to tell you how well you did in some arbitrary manner... Probably best to ignore it, or as you say, just take the piss with some wry comments about banditry if the cookie crumbles badly at this point... either way, it's a totally pointless exercise in the wider scheme of things. At best it's a validation exercise to tell us who the better sailors are (like we don't know already?!?), at worst it just pisses people off telling them they actually sailed like a total gimp in comparison. Given how many ex-sailors I know who say club handicap racing is just NOT of interest, I'd say there's a fundamental problem IF the sport wants to attract back some old blood... personally I can't see why new blood would stick it out in the first place given the cost and time requirements, as reflected by an earlier post suggesting 10-20% max return from adult courses. Edited by turnturtle - 26 May 22 at 11:06pm |
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Grumpycat ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 29 Sep 20 Online Status: Offline Posts: 497 |
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Oh dear . TT, someone criticises your point of view , you get all defensive and you go back to your old ways of posting ream’s and reams of well argued tosh.
I really don’t know why you even bother with this little forum because you don’t seem to like the sport of sailing or sailing in general or clubs or sailors because we don’t all agree we you. It must be hard being a messiah that no body follows .
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I think a subtle distinction can be made between taking your hobby (dinghy racing/boat ownership) seriously and taking an individual race (whether PY or fleet) seriously.
No one has to take every race seriously - you may prioritise the club regatta over the mid week series for example. Many people take the Bloody Mary seriously - just take a look at the names on the trophy. Many more do it because sailing in the depths of winter in a fleet of 150 boats has a perverse sense of worthiness. These people, who have no realistic prospect of winning, still pursue their hobby “seriously” (maybe that’s not quite the right word, maybe “keenly” or “with priority”) else they wouldn’t spend £12.5k on a secondhand 200 or spend a weekend freezing their tits off in a concrete bowl. As for At best it's a validation exercise to tell us who the better sailors are (like we don't know already?!?), at worst it just pisses people off telling them they actually sailed like a total gimp in comparison. Isn’t that what fleet racing is too? Edited by A2Z - 27 May 22 at 6:02am |
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