Overtaking Boat Relevancy ?

Originally posted by JimC Originally posted by Rupert In effect, overtaking boat keep clear has been subsumed into other rules, Rupert, I don't think its helpful to say that. There is nothing resembling an overtaking boat keeps clear rule in the RRS, and when you consider situations like two boats alongside alternately speeding up and slowing down on waves, its fairly clear that there cannot be one. A boat to leeward has right of way, no matter how it comes to be there, even though in some circumstances there are restrictions on where it can sail. The whole thread demonstrates the problems that arise when people have concepts in their head that are entirely absent from RRS.

Maybe I didn't word it quite right, the overtaking boat rule would clash with other rules, but as overtaking boat, you still have an obligation which is spelt out under different rules.

Originally posted by Rupert but as overtaking boat, you still have an obligation which is spelt out under different rules.

No... that's a terrible way to think. An overlapped leeward boat has right of way whether its overtaking, being overtaken just sailing alongside or what.

Its just that if the overlap is established from astern and within two boats lengths there is one restriction in what the ROW boat can do. If the overlap is established from leeward, then no matter what the relative speeds of the boats, then that restriction doesn't exist.

So if a boat is overtaking from well to leeward on a converging course there are no restrictions on its course.

You can always look up the rules on line, find them from http://www.sailing.org/documents/racing-rules.php

Edited by JimC - 08 Jul 17 at 11:02pm

Originally posted by sargesail Doesn't sound like it's the case here....but 'overtaking boat keep clear' said to leeward ROW by keep clear windward is about the most frequent bit of intimidation / bullying / cheating I reckon I hear on the Race Course.  Had it yacht racing a couple of weeks ago.....

Edited by Brass - 10 Jul 17 at 3:10am

Originally posted by Brass Originally posted by sargesail Doesn't sound like it's the case here....but 'overtaking boat keep clear' said to leeward ROW by keep clear windward is about the most frequent bit of intimidation / bullying / cheating I reckon I hear on the Race Course.  Had it yacht racing a couple of weeks ago..... Strongly disagree. It's wrong, but it's most likely an indication of ignorance, misunderstanding or confusion about the rules. Typically, even of beginners do read rule 12, they do so superfically, and say to themselves, 'oh, it's just the same as IRPCAS overtaking boat keep clear'. And how can a grown man in a 30 foot yacht bully another grown man in another 30 foot yacht? And ignorance or misunderstanding of the rules isn't anywhere near cheating.

Around the Solent it is commonly heard from people who have been racing for many years.
Last time it really riled me it was from somebody who'd won a race at a Nationals that year.
Definitely a low form of cheating in some cases.

Shout protest and luff hard.

Originally posted by KazRob It must be well over 30 years or indeed 50 years since it was in the rules,

I can't find any mention of overtaking in an electronic copy I have of a 1944 pamphlet with the Vanderbilt rules in, so I suspect its a lot longer than that. The only mention of overtaking I've ever seen* is in a copy of the 1910 Royal Canoe club racing rules, but its hard to imagine there's anyone alive who raced under those rules.

*I expect there are others of course, just what I've seen.