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JimC View Drop Down
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    Posted: 05 Jan 08 at 5:11pm
Originally posted by GK.LaserII

The keyhole thingy looks like the ramp system and we tried that last year.

Yep, except rather than the ramp thing in the middle you just have a plastic fairlead that it hooks up on when you push the pole out. The ramp thing that catches both ways seems like an extra complication to me, and when gybing one of *these* poles you don't want complication! The photo is at the 76 Worlds in Australia BTW. Note the wooden Bethwaite wing mast!



Edited by JimC
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tmoore View Drop Down
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Posts: 880 		Post Options Post Options   Quote tmoore Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 08 at 5:13pm

you could try the 'chase' system. here you have a fixed downhaul (sprung clip) which stays on all the time. the pole comes either under  or over (cant remember which) the jib sheets. each time you hoist/drop you clip on the uphaul. not used this system but i know it was used by richard estaugh to win the gp worlds a few years back.

alternatively the bow and arrow system (ramp) is very good. just rig the rope between the pole ends AROUND the loop for the rope and the pole goes THROUGH the loop. that way you cant lose the pole  (from experience )
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 08 at 6:41pm

Originally posted by Lukepiewalker

I'm having trouble envisaging this 'trolley' system. I have to say I have never used a ramp with one of those keyhole thingies as far as I can remember, usually just a loop of rope formed in the uphaul/downhaul line. I'm not sure how a single ended system is going to stop the kite collapsing either. Unless you have a fork end rather than a normal fitting...

Here's a pic of the "trolley" system. Note the bungee from the back of the boom around the front of the mast and back to the end of the boom. The inner end of the pole has a pulley attached which runs along the bungee. The pole uphaul/downhaul is permanently attached to the outer end of the pole.

http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/photos/?s=64&PID=18398

I'm hoping that this arrangement will be quicker for deployment as there's no hook or loop (metal or rope) to engage. Also easier to stow the pole as you just unclip the guy and sling it back in, no faffing about getting it in to a craddle.

The downside could be you have to bring the pole in to gybe also the bungee on the leward side of the sail might ruin the mainsail shape.

As you say a fork end would be better (See ColHs link (Nice one)) Bringing the pole in to gybe is not a problem if the kite stays full.

That Cherub pic must be an old one Jim. As for GRF implying that the symmetric is old fashioned, I've got a pic of a 1910 something or another with an asymmetric kite. I will scan it and post when I get around to it. Asymmetric might be easier but it's not better, I just prefer the other



Edited by GK.LaserII
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Lukepiewalker View Drop Down
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Posts: 1341 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 08 at 6:56pm
I see..... I'm slightly ashamed to say I have never seen that system before.
My concern about that would be that if your crew was just lobbing it backwards... that's where you are standing....
I have a friend who has a fork end on his Mirror spinnaker system which is ideal for the singlehanding as when he releases the pole the guy just pops out without requiring another hand to free it. The only downside is the potential for the guy to drop out during the launch, haven't seen it happen often.
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Posts: 861 		Post Options Post Options   Quote HannahJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 08 at 8:46pm
What puzzles me about the single-ended pole system with a fork on the end that I know is used on Mirrors for small crews, is how the spinnaker sheet is put into the fork - surely the crew has to do that anyway?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 08 at 9:09pm

Yep and the more I think about it, maybe the fork thingy is not appropriate. The one in ColHs link looks like it has to be pulled off thus collapsing the spinny. At least with the standard hook the guy will drop out when the release string is pulled.

 will try it and see.



Edited by GK.LaserII
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Lukepiewalker View Drop Down
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Posts: 1341 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan 08 at 10:07pm
Yes, the crew does have to put it in, but when the pole is released it automatically drops the guy, which is less faffing around for the gybes and drops. I think you would need to look at a fork end with an appropriate piece of rope, it doesn't (in my experience) require any manipulation to remove the guy from the pole, but equally when the pole is launched the forces hold it in place.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 08 at 12:06pm

Here's pic, Description says "Atlantic dead before the wind spinnaker set August1916"

is the spinny the thing sticking out on the left??? or the one on the front?? I dunno

 



Edited by GK.LaserII
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6661 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 08 at 12:56pm
The spinnaker is the one on the pole out to starboard. The pother is probably a balloon jib I guess. In those days the spinaker was set to windward of the jibs, not to leeward. The reason for that escapes me!
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Posts: 222 		Post Options Post Options   Quote landlocked Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 08 at 9:32pm
the description says that the boat is dead before the win ie dead run so it's just like goosewinging the jib surely?
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