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Null View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02 Mar 15 at 11:41am
Originally posted by davidyacht

Originally posted by Null

David, that's a bit unfair.  From a zero perspective, we had class association members manning the stand on both days.  I was there Saturday we had about 4 class members on the stand at anyone time, with Dan Holman around to field questions and Rodney on the Devoti stand.  I was talking to someone virtually all day.  The stand was frankly rediculously busy.   In fact I have never worked on a stand at the show like it! So saying couldn't be bothered is frankly wrong!  I was up at 5 am to get to the show, I didn't walk around I worked as did the other volunteers.  I can't comment on the rs commercial stand, but we were like I say a class if volunteers and I know how hard everyone worked.

Maybe I was a little sweeping ... However I did have a good look at the D0 since I have never seen one in the flesh, and never had my ear bent, which may or may not have been a good thing!

I fully accept that I am full of prejudices, but my problem with the Aero and to a lesser extent the D0 is hat I think that the technical aspects of the rigs have been stripped out in the pursuit of simplification and rationalisation in order to achieve price points, don't get me wrong, I can see why you might prefer either of these boats to a Laser, but I enjoy fiddling with all the variables on my Solo...

So what can you change or fiddle with on a Solo that you cant on a D-Zero?  other than centre board 'Rake'
The Zero has an adjustable mast foot position (same as a solo) Chocks (same as a solo) Cunningham, Kicker, Outhall, Traveller....All the same as a Solo.  It uses a Carbon two piece Rig, which probably costs more due to being un-stayed than a Solo mast.  It uses a halyard system much like the solo, but a Halyard lock, which is superior to many rope or rack and wire systems.  I can't see (from a zero perspective)  where the compromise has been over usability vs. price point.  I cant comment on the Aero but have my own views which i wont bore everyone with again.  I understand what you are saying, its just in reality its not the case.  The difference in cost will be down to the Solo having a ruleset that stops advancements in technology (alloy spars) and the fact it was design to be built in wood not composites so modern boats will take longer and cost more to build.
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Mar 15 at 11:17am
Having come through the servants' entrance both days, I didn't see as much as I wanted to of the dinghy cruising part of the show in the hallway. Was it good?

As for jaded and not enjoying it - nope, had a great time, as did Rupertson, who is already planning next year. Child 2 also had a wonderful time on the Sunday, running round collecting everything in sight - surprised she didn't blag a free boat. Wonderful now the kids are old enough to range around by themselves. My wife spent a lot of time talking to Firefly sailors and drinking tea!
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ChrisI View Drop Down
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Posts: 143 		Post Options Post Options   Quote ChrisI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Mar 15 at 10:24am
"So perhaps we're a bit jaded".

I think there's a lot of jaded people on here.
I thought it was great.

Just because the theme this year seemed to be on dinghy cruising....

(....so have you heard the one about the person who wants to sail across the Atlantic in a dinghy?....)
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getafix View Drop Down
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Posts: 2143 		Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Mar 15 at 10:10am
Sounds miss-able.  Should be somewhere in the midlands so more people can get to it.  That said, I know a couple of new-to-the-sport people who went and said it was great.  So perhaps we're a bit jaded.  I still look back with rosy-tinted-specs at the Crystal Palace days....
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Woodbotherer View Drop Down
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Posts: 192 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Woodbotherer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Mar 15 at 9:40am
Originally posted by craiggo

It was very quiet this afternoon Graeme. I didnt hear your dulcet tones coming from the Solution stand (I was on the stand next to the Phantoms) so assumed they'd gotten away with it
Well they didn't, I wondered why they were all crossing themselves and each shoving the other forward to come and talk to me and that poor young Valerie got the short straw initially, then one after the other they came out from behind the counter where they'd been spread eagled as if a GP14er had just come on the stand looking for change for a fiver for the phone box. And that was only because I was in disguise, having the breadknife and daughter of darkness no 4 with me.

So we had a long chat, it was good for me it wasn't busy, other than a chap from the Miracle class I couldn't shoo away with a request that he was improperly dressed without his bandoleer and poncho. Wink
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turnturtle View Drop Down
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Mar 15 at 9:17am
Originally posted by davidyacht

Went to the Dinghy Show on Saturday, had a pleasant enough time and met a few old friends and picked up my copy of Real Magic, a serious labour of love by Dougal.

However I struggle to determine what the current format of the show is trying to achieve?

Generally the traditional (independent) class stands are manned by the regular class enthusiasts, nothing wrong with this, and it most of the visitors appear to be equally partisan class aficionados.  

The OEM classes were displaying their ranges on "me too" products, which hardly warranted more than a cursory glance, because there is not much point looking at a strict one design if you have seen it once before.

Strangely the two classes that I could be seen to be in the target market for, the Aero and the D-zero made no effort to engage with me or my mate... But there you go.

Anyway my real problem with the show was how difficult it must be for somebody looking to take up the sport of dinghy racing to engage with what is going on ... Everyone seems to be so wrapped up in there own little bit at the top of the pyramid, that they are completely missing the base.

By the way, my votes for the most affable and engaging people on stands go to the Hornets and the National 18s, they seemed to be keen to talk to those outside of their class, not sure if I will ever sail either, but they raised their profile in my eyes.

I will start a new thread on where I see the RYA in all of this...

So you've identified what I did last time I went, probably 10 years ago.  Okay so some new boats have come and others gone, and I;m sure there's some electronic point of sale gizmos to play with on some stalls now, but essentially the show hasn't moved on since I was a kid.  And there's no harm in that really, at least it's not trying to sell something that differs grossly from the reality of the sport in question.  

Would complete newcomers or non-sailors really go?  I would have thought the spectacle and novelty value would suit someone in their first couple of years of sailing- by which time they are probably hooked, and hopefully listening to fellow club members about what boat to buy etc.  I'm sure neither professional salesmen nor overly-ethusiastic class weirdos are great for local class development.  

I noted from my windsurfing buddies they were out enjoying F5 and sunny (dare I say, 'spring') conditions this weekend.  For my sins I was not sailing at all and instead spent the time teaching my eldest daughter how to fly a kite in glorious sunshine and steady breeze that had lost its 'winter bite'.   Our club Facebook page shows some hardy souls braved the breeze to be greeted with some unexpected, excellent sailing.

I'm not sure any of these activities could be beaten by trudging around an exhibition hall - no matter what the subject matter.  So other than me changing my outlook and treating it like a social only activity, which is what it seems to be for friends who do go, I don't really see what the RYA or anyone could do to make me want to attend.     


Edited by turnturtle - 02 Mar 15 at 9:23am
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Posts: 30 		Post Options Post Options   Quote ds2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 15 at 10:43pm
The Farr was on the Butler Boats stand. Very nice it looked too. Was very impressed with his streaker as well, a lovely piece of kit.
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davidyacht View Drop Down
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Posts: 1345 		Post Options Post Options   Quote davidyacht Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 15 at 10:43pm
Originally posted by Null

David, that's a bit unfair.  From a zero perspective, we had class association members manning the stand on both days.  I was there Saturday we had about 4 class members on the stand at anyone time, with Dan Holman around to field questions and Rodney on the Devoti stand.  I was talking to someone virtually all day.  The stand was frankly rediculously busy.   In fact I have never worked on a stand at the show like it! So saying couldn't be bothered is frankly wrong!  I was up at 5 am to get to the show, I didn't walk around I worked as did the other volunteers.  I can't comment on the rs commercial stand, but we were like I say a class if volunteers and I know how hard everyone worked.

Maybe I was a little sweeping ... However I did have a good look at the D0 since I have never seen one in the flesh, and never had my ear bent, which may or may not have been a good thing!

I fully accept that I am full of prejudices, but my problem with the Aero and to a lesser extent the D0 is hat I think that the technical aspects of the rigs have been stripped out in the pursuit of simplification and rationalisation in order to achieve price points, don't get me wrong, I can see why you might prefer either of these boats to a Laser, but I enjoy fiddling with all the variables on my Solo...
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craiggo View Drop Down
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Posts: 1810 		Post Options Post Options   Quote craiggo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 15 at 10:18pm
It was very quiet this afternoon Graeme. I didnt hear your dulcet tones coming from the Solution stand (I was on the stand next to the Phantoms) so assumed they'd gotten away with it

You are right though, there was no zing this year. There was no recent Olympics to highlight, no imminent Olympics, no big releases and even the development classes seem to have stopped developing for a while.

Interestingly we were pretty busy on the Graduate stand, and it did seem like there was more interest in the few wooden boats on show. Other than Tim Harpers fantastic sparkly hulled Graduate, my favourite boat of the show was the Idol Composites OK on the Harken stand.
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Posts: 192 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Woodbotherer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Mar 15 at 9:58pm
They'd dozed off one the lightning stand by the time the Mrs and I passed by, we didn't like to wake them. In fact I found the whole show experience this year a bit dozy. Outside you wouldn't even know there was a show going on, no external exhibits, where yesteryear would have seen the hearses brand of choice exhibiting it's pointless estate vehicles.
OK so it was Sunday lunchtime, but I brushed aside the tumble weed, had my choice of three folk eager to take my cash, refusing my request for concessionary tickets, i laughed and said I can understand that, with this show if you gave them pretty much everyone would be in on them, she laughed and said that was exactly what the persona few minutes ago had just said.
I breezed past the Devoti stand didn't see anyone I knew, the Lightnings had dozed off, so i made for the Solution stand where I spent an interesting afternoon finding out everything there is to know about them.

It was quiet though, saw Mark he'd reported it being busier yesterday, 3% up apparently, but there was no fizz. Someone had foiled up an unremarkable Cat and it won boat of the show clearly Mark had voted as such as a bizarre jest to wind me up, so I went and had a look, the foils looked pretty agricultural compared to the stuff we see on kite boards these days, but there was a video that indicated that it did climb up onto them eventually, probably a bit like Laser on foils which i note didn't seem to be around this time. I looked for the Farr couldn't find it, missed the OK again, noticed they'd centreboarded the Buzz, swung by the Alto stand, had a mooch around the fireballs, they so need an Assym and swinging pole out of the front, maybe one day.
Checked out the Vortex, they've done a fair job, looked at the Icon and noted it's pole arrangement which is different to the one we have on loan, then back to the Solution stand, which was right next door to the cake and pie free phantom zone. No offer of being the filling in their sandwich this year, they appear to be as oppressed as the Muslims would have you believe they are and everywhere, the word RYA was uttered prefixed by some profanity or other.
They really have lost the plot and I felt it pervaded the entire show, but maybe it was the Rugby.
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