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Old Timer View Drop Down
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    Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 4:10pm
Originally posted by SimonW99

Laser hulls sailed on the sea are also notorious for putting on a bit of middle aged spread! 

What? In what way is a Laser any more prone to gain weight than any other dinghy?


Originally posted by SimonW99

Not sure where you are getting your PY's from but even the aero 7 handicap is 22 points harsher than afull rig Laser. the 9 is 57 points lower on our initial sea handicap of 1035, so its a decent bit faster.

Similar ... is what I said...

Anyway, the fact that the helm weight is movable doesn't change the physics of acceleration.

F = ma ... if the Aero is 15% lighter then for the same force generated by the rig (roughly) it will accelerate 15% more ... hardly a game changer ....
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Old Timer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Old Timer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 4:11pm
Originally posted by turnturtle

Look Old Timer - this is Sailing 2.0 .... 'Aeronauting'.... it's just closer racing than ever conceivably possible in the Laser; you have to believe Simon they had 6 boats out the other day..... and it's all down to the lightweight, rooftop friendly package!

Ah ... I see ... will they soon have a 400 boat masters worlds as well?
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 4:17pm
Do we really need all this trolling and FUD from certain parties?

This is a thread for a particular class. That the owners are enthusiastic about sailing their boats is surely just a matter for congratulation, even if those of use who've banged the drum for lightweight boats for thirty years or more might be tempted to heave a quiet sigh. Anything that gets people enthusiastic about sailing again seems good to me, and I really don't think it needs a bunch of knocking,
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Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 4:22pm
no one's knocking the boat, nor the enthusiasm... just some of the wilder claims and fan boyish statements, which could be seen as somewhat passive aggressive towards one of the very few boats left which is delivering close class racing at club level.

Edited by turnturtle - 10 Feb 15 at 4:24pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Old Timer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 4:23pm
Originally posted by turnturtle

no one's knocking the boat, nor the enthusiasm... just some of the wilder claims and fan boyish statements.


Agreed: comments like this are hardly on ...

Originally posted by SimonW99

Laser hulls sailed on the sea are also notorious for putting on a bit of middle aged spread! 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 4:50pm
If you bother to read and consider what has been said, there has never been any comment saying that any of these new boats will ever reach even a fraction of the numbers of the laser. In fact you could, as has been said before, probably add up every other singlehander sailing and there would still be thousands, probably 10's of thousands more lasers. The world has changed, and its impossible to see that sort of thing ever happening again.

As for weight as someone who has had more lasers than I care to remember over a long period and yes even weighed them and dried them out, they are made from glass and on the sea in particular, they do gain weight and yes they do go soft eventually. I have never had one that I could weigh that was right down to weight and my last one was 3.9 kg over when new. You are welcome to disagree, but polyester boats absorb weight over a period and there are plenty on here far more qualified than me who will confirm that. So the comment is completely "on". If you want to big up the laser you can start a thread to do that, apart from the fact these threads are about developments and its 40 years too late..

Last time I looked 55 points was quite a bit faster, perhaps I'll accept that a supernova at 1073 is 'Similar' to a Laser at 1087, but then again I always found the Nova faster round a course. 

In context the 9 is 'similar' to a Blaze on handicap and if you think a Blaze and a Laser are similar round a course in reasonable breeze then think again.

The aero and for that matter the Dzero are certainly very 'similar' around a course as the sail juice figures will bear out, but they are also both quicker and nicer to sail than a Laser. 

If you want feedback from aero owners then we will happily give it. If you don't believe it then go get in a boat and try it for yourself before sledging on a subject about which you have no direct knowledge. 

And again if you don't think that a 15% less weight (your calc, I think its more) makes no difference off wind, then perhaps you might let all those builders striving to get the odd kilo here and there out of not only dinghies but keelboats, your secret so they can stop wasting all that effort. As for having as much ballast as possible moveable making no difference to boat speed around a course, then well again, all these designers must be wasting so much time.


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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 5:01pm
Originally posted by turnturtle


no one's knocking the boat,


So who posted "until it blows off the trolley and splits open down the side that is" then?

Classic piece of FUD knocking that is...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 5:03pm
Simon- you are making wild claims that the boat produces closer racing- and that is driven by the reduction in weight.  

If you are experiencing notably closer racing then that's great.  But it could be for a number of factors, one not least being that a certain class rep / unbiased boat reviewer is driving forward a decent training programme and that 'new boat shine' means you're all giving it a bit more beans this year compared to floating around in handicap dross....  

I for one am really, really impressed that 20 of you have the means and willpower to put aside possible personal preferences in favour of common objectives, that it worth its weight in gold when it comes to forum contribution alone.

But if there's one thing I think we could all learn from the 100 launch it's that hype might sell, but it doesn't last and I wouldn't knock the Laser- it is after all the very business model RS appear to be emulating with this product launch.  
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Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 5:07pm
Originally posted by JimC

Originally posted by turnturtle


no one's knocking the boat,


So who posted "until it blows off the trolley and splits open down the side that is" then?

Classic piece of FUD knocking that is...

applies to any boat Jim....  lighter ones are more at risk.  I've certainly had a Musto Skiff and Lasers blow clean off the trolley, I doubt very much that an Aero or Zero are free from such concern. 

FWIW, I plan to have a strap for my D-Zero for windy weather rigging.  

My point was in response to Old Timer - 'light boats' have their own set of compromises, not least of which is what I call the 'stable manners' when rigging and launching alone.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 15 at 5:16pm
Jim

I can assure you that after 4 pints on boon dongle at a friends party on Saturday night I was so far from 'on the case' on Sunday that I would have been much better last year LOL

It went a bit like this .... Launch..... damn, haven't routed the Halyard tail properly Wacko... up on the deck and do it whilst floating around mid river trying not to fall in..... back to the cockpit and sheet in.......damn, haven't even attached the downhaul Pinch.... back on the deck, nearly fall in......back to the cockpit and sheet in. hear the 5 minute gun, can't see flags....... right two minutes to go time to get back to the start - hold on why are those spinnakers up (downwind start) ...oh damn....... and on it went.....
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