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modified one designs

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kneewrecker View Drop Down
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    Posted: 10 Jun 14 at 7:33pm
Originally posted by Medway Maniac

Originally posted by Rupert

I really enjoyed sailing the Aero the other day....... I can see me sailing one in my 60's!

Meaning what about the boat?

it's preferable to a Solo?  I should damn well hope so.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 14 at 7:52pm
Meaning that there will be 15 year old clunkers around in my price range...
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Medway Maniac View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Medway Maniac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 14 at 8:13pm
If you will have so many boats to maintain...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 14 at 9:00pm
I know, but its fun.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 14 at 9:36pm
Originally posted by iGRF

Originally posted by SUGmeister

if someone were to take the mould of a <insert name of just about every dinghy ever made> and build a lightweight version of it, it would be a better boat.



ftfy

ironically, as a previous subscriber to the view "lighter is always better" I'd actually settle for a little extra bulk on the 100 if it added a foot or so to improve the upwind speed in light/med winds.  I also rode a really beautiful super-light carbon bike the other day, flexed so much I felt odd uphill and much prefer my much heavier alloy bike (for my un-athletic bulk), so lighter not always better....
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jun 14 at 10:20am
Originally posted by SUGmeister

Back on topic, the shackle draggers have a bit of history taking one designs and improving them for their own market...

12 Sq Mtr Sharpie



Australian version...



They took Uffa's Jollyboat and did something similar (Well at least I think they improved upon it)

I've often thought, especially in this day of groovy singlehanders if someone were to take the mould of a finn and build a lightweight version of it, put a RS100 rig on, flog it for £7000 instead of £17000 would it be a better boat?


The boats that were lightened and improved down here were different from most of the boats in other countries, which can't be given the same treatment. The boats that received the lightweight treatment were designs like the Sharpie which were, even in their original heavy form, flat in rocker and section. Such boats are popular in Oz, where winds in the sailing season tend to be stronger than in most other places and there is very little inland/lake sailing. We also tended to add more crew weight to give them more leverage to handle our stronger winds. 

The Kiwis were similar in many ways but their boats tended to have more beam and less length; I suspect that this is at least partly because they had some nice protected waterways and therefore were more into day cruising (as was the case in the USA) and perhaps because they had less money per boat, smaller cars, etc.

This historical chance meant that Oz was in a unique situation when plywood arrived and allowed us to make lighter boats. If you have a skinny, flat boat with more crew weight than other places would give it, when you reduce hull weight you are left with a boat that is still sailing to its original lines, or something pretty close to it. Therefore the whole thing ends up working pretty damn well most of the time.

Records from the time the lightweights arrived also show that the real attraction was not the extra speed (although that was appreciated) but the economy and ease of construction, maintenance and launching/carrying across the many sandy beaches. The speed aspect only gained precedence in hindsight.

Boats in other countries tend to have more curve in rocker and section because they are designed for lighter average winds and for other cultural/technological reasons. If you take a whole lot of weight out of them, they end up with too much rocker and not enough waterline or waterline beam. They just don't work as well when you take weight out, and being lighter may also be of less use if you have light winds and different launching setups.

So while I'm a lightweight boat fan by preference and birth, there may be significant problems in taking what worked down here and applying it to other areas. It's not a case of one style being good and the other bad, just different solutions for different situations IMHO.

 


Edited by Chris 249 - 11 Jun 14 at 10:22am
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jun 14 at 11:04am
OTOH, if we average 20lbs heavier than our grandfathers, if we take 20lbs weight out of our boats to compensate for the 20lbs added to our midsections, the boats will probably be sailing on pretty much the same marks...
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Medway Maniac View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Medway Maniac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jun 14 at 11:09am
Good points, Chris and Jim.

So, it’s the Halo not the Fire that needs the lightweight treatment!
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2547 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote 2547 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jun 14 at 11:14am
Originally posted by Medway Maniac

Good points, Chris and Jim.

So, it’s the Halo not the Fire that needs the lightweight treatment!

No ... it is the helm that need the lightweight treatment ...



Edited by 2547 - 11 Jun 14 at 11:15am
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jun 14 at 11:32am
Originally posted by Medway Maniac

So, it’s the Halo not the Fire

Normally better, in my opinion, to develop an all new boat that reflects all current technology and thinking.
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