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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Icon Class Association
    Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 1:03pm
Just had a look at the Icon class website...


·       Custom high-modulus carbon rig - light, responsive, low profile
·      Advanced low drag hull form - yet stable and forgiving
·       Highly developed sail plan – optimised for 2-sail performance all around the course
·       Suitable to most types of racing course – and across wide ranging wind conditions
·       Lightweight - approx 87kg ALL-UP sailing weight
·       PN (recommendation)1020


PN slower than a Tasar!!??!! That's outrageous. Every single feature of the boat listed should make it faster than a Tasar... That has to be the worst bit of banditry I've ever seen, and I'm normally in print as saying there's no such thing...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote winging it Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 12:25pm
I'm going to be visiting the Icon stand at the show.  I'm beginning to think it's the perfect double hander for our gravel pit.  As usual, can't find a price for used boats, but hopefully we can pin someone down on the day.
the same, but different...

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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 11:43am
ENs mean it should get a review after 6 months, AIUI anyway.  Of course how you manage change, and the bad feeling when should the number rise significantly and this New Kid on the Block starts doing well, is another matter entirely.

Statistics fail to account for the human element.... which is a shame, if you were going to give any bias at all, then imho, giving new designs a bit of a boost would add a good vibe that would echo and resonate a positive message throughout the sailing community.

Is there a legal term where a third party's activity indirectly affects ones business through the course of their own endeavour?  If there is, then I'd say the RYA has a case to answer from Cirrus/Devoti.  Not sure how you'd actually prove that someone didn't buy a boat because the handicap was poor.... but it does happen.


Edited by yellowwelly - 27 Feb 14 at 11:52am
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 11:42am
Originally posted by blaze720

so precisely at '969' ...

Well of course its not exactly 969. That's just a mid point. Its 969 plus minus whatever. Especially for an experimental number.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 11:36am
Having only sailed the Icon once, in just a puff of breeze, I haven't got much idea, but it went so well I wouldn't be at all surprised to see it trounce Merlins in the kind of weather where spinnakers won't really start pulling. If others say it will beat them in a big breeze, then handicap wise, maybe it will turn out to be somewhere inbetween what the RYA says and what the general feeling is.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote scotsfinn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 10:28am
Originally posted by iGRF

Faster than an RS500? Come on, who are these people?

'Spose we'll just have to go sailing and enjoy a right good thraaashin! OuchThe boat is still great to sail and that hasn't changed. 
Mike, Rodney, Devoti get your head down at the dinghy show (no Brandy and Babycham for you lot) and sell loads of Icons, we can then all go one design and forget PY! (and that DZero thinghy ..... well I heard it's going to be off of 969 too!) Wink


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Post Options Post Options   Quote blaze720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 10:20am
Hey guys .. We were not expecting much support from non-Iconists both here and direct ... thanks for that !

I would be interesting to see the actual data crunched to end up so precisely at '969' ... We monitor all Icon results we can get our hands on when actual timings are recorded and available.   Anyway we (The CA) will formally write to the RYA first and request what sample size, data etc have been used to work up this starting number.  

The 'new' number is only published as 'experimental' to be fair and it is for clubs, as encouraged by that venerable organ, to adjust them locally.  We do have a direct interest, of course, but it will be in everyones intersts that the workings are made available .. and quickly.   I'm sure they will have used available numbers in a correct manner.   But here as in life in general you have to be seen as 'fair' as well.  So lets know about the sample used .... there can be little reason for secrecy.

Mike L.

PS -  But  just WAIT until you see the 'T' shirts planned !... maybe not in time for the show sadly Tongue
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 9:39am
Faster than an RS500? Come on, who are these people?
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 9:36am
I'm fairly sure the SJ series isn't used as part of the calcs.... with regards the ICON, at 969 it makes it too quick to be allowed on the some of the close, confined waters around here.  Which is a real shame, one of its overriding impressions it left on me at the FOM was that it seemed a lovely boat to be sailing somewhere 'Broxbourne like'.

So yes, it does rather set the conspiracy, anti-competition alarm bells off... but then that's paranoia and a sense of frustration that one boat I would have potentially bought when my kids were a bit bigger is now stricken from the list.

disappointing...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote fdsailor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 14 at 9:32am
I know this has been hacked to death but clubs can (should, and do) set their own numbers. That's the system. It's just that they also send them in for some kind of agglomeration which pumps out a single standard number which is necessarily imperfect in many ways. If you think this is bad, have a look at NHC! LOL
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