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Dinghy hull coatings

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Lukepiewalker View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Dinghy hull coatings
    Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 9:35am
Road film. Bethwaite has an experiment in the first HPS book where he tested the effect. Think of all the rubber, oil, diesel, tar and assorted other crap getting thrown up by the wheels of yours and passing vehicles. And consider the effort required to clean the same film off your car.

Edited by Lukepiewalker - 13 Dec 13 at 9:35am
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Lukepiewalker View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 9:48am
Or if you are feeling really keen, look at a roundabout after a heavy rainstorm and see the pretty rainbow patterns from all the diesel mixing with the rainwater. Roundabouts are particularly prone to diesel spilling out of lorries as they go round the sharp turn.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mark300 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 10:17am
Bethwaite did indeed look at hull and foil finishes in HPS.  He took two identical Laser rudders, finished them both to 1200 grit wet and dry, and then polished one of them to a mirror finish.  His experiment using the foils showed the unpolished foil showed a 23% reduction "in cross flow lift force, i.e. the steering force at 11 knots".  So he concludes that not only does a polished foil reduce drag, but it improves control.

HPS2 had some measurements on different finishes on 49er hulls, after noting degraded performance in a boat covered in a film traffic grime.  He basically concluded that the higher the polish, the less the resistance (can't find the page in the book, its a heavy read that one).

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Post Options Post Options   Quote sandgrounder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 10:32am
Originally posted by JimC

As I said before, if my memory serves me right RRS 53 was originally written to prohibit a polymer based material that you gunged on before the day's sailing, and which slowly dissolved/melted/something or another into the water over the day. I'm certain any kind of normal wax or teflon polish is just fine.
 
Teflon is a polymer, hence the potential for conflict. I know a World Champion / Olympian who avoids teflon based polishes for this reason.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mark300 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 11:02am
Originally posted by Timmus

If I remember correctly he did the experiment by towing Tasar hulls around. One that had been covered and another that had been taken to venue uncovered on the road.

Funny I have just started re-reading HPS (hardback) and was wondering if it was available on Kindle or variants????
Its a heavy read indeed, but even heavier in hardback  Smile


You are right - it is in HPS, two boats go to the same venue and back uncovered, one gets washed and cleaned, the other doesn't.  2% difference in hull drag according to Bethwaites experiment.

His conclusions are (i) and polished clean hull is fastest, (ii) there is no evidence to support the "a rough surface holds a layer of water on the hull and is fast" claims, and (iii) the area of shark skin type finishes is not sufficiently understood to replicate into dinghies hull finishes.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 11:27am
Originally posted by sandgrounder

Teflon is a polymer,

Gel coat's a polymer too. So is epoxy resin and polyurethane paint.

These papers includes some of the sorts of research that prompted the ban.

http://conservancy.umn.edu/bitstream/114203/1/pr090.pdf
http://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstream/handle/2027.42/62411/belbing_1.pdf?sequence=1

The crucial part of the rule is that its a water soluble polymer that is *ejected or released* into the water, thus causing pollution. That is not what's going on when you apply a conventional polish - ie anything you can buy from a car shop, because they don't eject or release anything as part of the function of the polish. Either your man misunderstands the rule, or possibly you've misunderstood him.

Edited by JimC - 13 Dec 13 at 11:28am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sandgrounder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 11:45am
Originally posted by JimC

Originally posted by sandgrounder

Teflon is a polymer,

Gel coat's a polymer too. So is epoxy resin and polyurethane paint.

These papers includes some of the sorts of research that prompted the ban.

http://conservancy.umn.edu/bitstream/114203/1/pr090.pdf
http://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstream/handle/2027.42/62411/belbing_1.pdf?sequence=1

The crucial part of the rule is that its a water soluble polymer that is *ejected or released* into the water, thus causing pollution. That is not what's going on when you apply a conventional polish - ie anything you can buy from a car shop, because they don't eject or release anything as part of the function of the polish. Either your man misunderstands the rule, or possibly you've misunderstood him.
 
Gelcoat, epoxy resin and polyurethane paint don't dissolve in water.
 
Teflon based polymer polish applied to hull / foils does dissolve in water.
 
I only know what he told me - he's a lot closer to ISAF than I am.
 
There are many alternative methods of achieving a superior finish to hull and more importantly foils, one of which I've mentioned above. Why would you take the risk at that level of competition?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote MerlinMags Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 11:48am
Originally posted by Reuben T

I have heard that sanding to around 600 grit is the most efficient finish as it creates a boundary layer of water moving with the boat, so it effectively lu<span style="line-height: 1.4;">bricates the hull with water. I was told this by a friend of Phil Morrison who said this was a theory that Phil believed in, therefore I am inclined to believe it.</span>


This was published in many dinghy racing books of the 80s, but has since been proven wrong. Smoother/polished is better, according to all the modern books.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 12:16pm
So what's the best product, having done some investigation after earlier posts I now see Farecla is a rubbing/cuting compound, so basically another variation on t-cut (perhaps not as 'harsh'). Once my hull is smooth, what's the best 'polish', or 'teflon wax', to keep it clean and slippery?

Edited by getafix - 13 Dec 13 at 12:17pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec 13 at 2:05pm
green vinyl wrap innit?
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