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Sail Juice 2013-14 Series

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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Sail Juice 2013-14 Series
    Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 9:34am
well I'm sure the data gets uploaded into the national numbers... but of course that is nothing different from a localised handicap.

I was also informed (in a meeting I had with the RYA when I cared about PY numbers) that qualitative data is also used before numbers are published- especially with new or radically changing classes.  This included SJ events.  I know Chris sits on the Great Lakes system committee, so FWIW, glad that the broad experience with handicap racing - and the only open, multi-venue handicap series - does have direct engagement 'at the top' with the PYAG. 

Personally I don't have any issues with the use of the SJ data in setting the national numbers- quite the reverse in fact, at least the GL system is adapting the PY as set out in the guidelines for usage.

Will I be attending any of them- highly unlikely.  Any 'away matches' for me are windsurfing these days, and if I was ever going to use my road base again, it would probably be for an open meeting somewhere salty, as I'd like to try the Solo on the sea at some point, especially in some waves.  But as Getafix says, plenty do attend them, and if this is one of the few times you could access windward/leeward racing with more than 4 others on the start line (GGP / SN) then beggars can't be choosers.  Both were great events last time I did them.

I'm busy on the Saturday of the Dash, otherwise would have come along for local support reasons, but I'll draw the line at doing a Pursuit Race on the Sunday.... if it's windy I might be around windsurfing, so hope that the 'member's only' parking will properly observed by the non-members freeloaders honoured guests  LOL


Edited by yellowwelly - 11 Nov 13 at 9:42am
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 9:16am
Originally posted by yellowwelly

Fact 1: SailJuice event results get discussed by the PYAG before finalising the annual list

News to me. Are you sure?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 9:15am
The facts cannot be equally applied simply because there are varying amounts of data from each class, and no way of knowing the variation of skills between results sets. If every club using the system sent in returns, then any influence from the results from the sailjuice series would have vanishingly small influence. For all I know, it does.

For all its faults, I'm am totally unconvinced that any other system suggested on here would be anything like as accurate.

What bothers me about the sailjuice system is that they mix it with the normal one, so a class new to the event will sail off the standard Pn, but a regular boat will have been changed, even though they might be very similar in speed and handicap.

Not that handicaps are the reason I won't be going - I'd rather get cold nearer to home.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 9:06am
Originally posted by alstorer


Could we stick to facts?


If it were derived by facts (equally applied), then there could be no conjecture.
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yellowwelly View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 9:06am
Originally posted by alstorer

 
Could we stick to facts?

sure.

Fact 1: SailJuice event results get discussed by the PYAG before finalising the annual list

your turn


Edited by yellowwelly - 11 Nov 13 at 9:06am
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alstorer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote alstorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 9:00am
the Sailjuice numbers have very little influence on the rest of the PY system apart from at clubs that choose to use those numbers rather than the RYAs published numbers
 
Could we stick to facts?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 8:43am
Originally posted by getafix

Oh dear, it's that time of year again when this forum does it's best to represent these events as awful racing, plagued by cheats and bandits and ruined by the <perceived> troubles of the PY system.... yet somehow, loads of people manage to go, sail, have a good time and register again to go the next year.
.... what could possibly be the right picture?


Well for my part, it's not just all of the above, it is the knock on effect the gerrymandering of the PY system has on us for the rest of the year and it's happening again if you care to study their anarchic calculations. Which you cannot help but come to the conclusion there is an element of trade and professional bias in play which suggests to the casual observer an element of financially induced well corruption is perhaps too strong a word but lets say brand favouritism or cronyism . Now, it may not be and I'd be the first to proffer an apology were it not the case, but the extreme moves of certain brands/boats against the totally static nature of others does nothing other than to convince me that all is not as it should be.

That's why I think it sucks.

Edited by iGRF - 11 Nov 13 at 8:45am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Paramedic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 8:25am
I may do one or two, won't do the whole series though.

However - whats the knock on effect to club sailing going to be with an event more or less every fortnight (I bet you could do an "away" event almost every weekend if you wanted to)? The winter series used to be the premier club series of the year, if all the good guys were to decide to do sailjuice it'll be pretty flat at a lot of clubs.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote winging it Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 7:48am
I can't do Draycote because I'm on coaching duty at Hunts, otherwise I hope to do as many as my crocked knee will allow, either in the D1 or a vareo.

I went oop north last year for the Brass Monkey  and have to say the weather was truly grim, as you would expect so close to the Pole.  However, the event itself was superb; great northern hospitality,  well organised, excellent clubhouse and facilities, friendly people.  Well worth the trek.
the same, but different...

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Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Nov 13 at 7:29am
Oh dear, it's that time of year again when this forum does it's best to represent these events as awful racing, plagued by cheats and bandits and ruined by the <perceived> troubles of the PY system.... yet somehow, loads of people manage to go, sail, have a good time and register again to go the next year.

.... what could possibly be the right picture?
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