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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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Posts: 4028 		Post Options Post Options   Quote G.R.F. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Grafham Grand Prix
    Posted: 07 Jan 12 at 11:16am
I've often wondered why they don't engineer kites on fast assyms with windows, we pay enough for them..
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Contender443 View Drop Down
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Posts: 1211 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender443 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jan 12 at 10:05am
Originally posted by iwsmithuk
 
When all of this goes badly wrong, resulting in serious injury or worse, it will be interesting to see where the lawyers think the liability lies, and whether the insurers feel they should cover the resultant claim or whether it should be covered by the sailor/manufacturer/race organisers themselves.
 
It would be interesting to see a post from any of the major insurers on this subject, I dont recall that happening last time we had this thread, not very reassuring.
 
A ticking time bomb.......
 
[/QUOTE

I don't think the insurers will bat an eyelid, they will just pay up. If you think about how many road accidents are caused by vehicles not being aware of their blind spots. I am sure the insurers just pay up on these claims. Ask a policeman who attends RTAs how often he has heard "I didn't see them".
 
So not a ticking time bomb just a fact of the game we play. This has nothing to do with mixing classes on the same course. The same could be said for a class race.
I don't think the insurers will bat an eyelid, they will just pay up. If you think about how many road accidents are caused by vehicles not being aware of their blind spots. I am sure the insurers just pay up on these claims. Ask a policeman who attends RTAs how often he has heard "I didn't see them".
 
So not a ticking time bomb just a fact of the game we play. This has nothing to do with mixing classes on the same course. The same could be said for a class race.
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iwsmithuk View Drop Down
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Posts: 141 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iwsmithuk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jan 12 at 9:32am
Originally posted by Ruscoe

Dan is right, musto downwind with kite on starboard 800 going upwind on starboard, big crash huge hole in Musto 800 looked fine.  No hail from either boat but i would think the 800 was in the musto's blind spot.  I was about 10 yards away when it happened.  its just one of those things!!
 
This discussion has been had before.
 
Sailors sailing boats they know to have a blind spot. Manufacturers selling boats they know to have a blind spot. Race organisers putting on events for boats known to have blind spots.
 
When all of this goes badly wrong, resulting in serious injury or worse, it will be interesting to see where the lawyers think the liability lies, and whether the insurers feel they should cover the resultant claim or whether it should be covered by the sailor/manufacturer/race organisers themselves.
 
It would be interesting to see a post from any of the major insurers on this subject, I dont recall that happening last time we had this thread, not very reassuring.
 
A ticking time bomb.......
 
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Ruscoe View Drop Down
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Posts: 1514 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Ruscoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 12 at 11:12pm
Dan is right, musto downwind with kite on starboard 800 going upwind on starboard, big crash huge hole in Musto 800 looked fine.  No hail from either boat but i would think the 800 was in the musto's blind spot.  I was about 10 yards away when it happened.  its just one of those things!!

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sargesail View Drop Down
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Posts: 1459 		Post Options Post Options   Quote sargesail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 12 at 7:35pm
800 suffered some gunnel grazing couple of feet short of the bow that's all.  
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Dan MPS View Drop Down
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Posts: 20 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Dan MPS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 12 at 6:48pm
I believe it was a windward leeward both on starboard. I think the musto was coming down wind and didnt see the 800. Big hole in the front of the musto, didnt see what happened to the 800 though.
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Hughph View Drop Down
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Posts: 324 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Hughph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 12 at 6:23pm
Is there anymore news on whatever happened between this MPS and an 800? 
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Dan MPS View Drop Down
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Posts: 20 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Dan MPS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 12 at 6:20pm
The corrected times are all posted on the grafham site now.
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Posts: 323 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Neal_g Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 12 at 7:50am
there was me thinking it was your super crew sam.
fireball weather weather for the BM too show your stuff.
 
as for corrected times if you click on r1 or r2  they are blue so hyperlinks they take you to corrected times
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SamM View Drop Down
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Posts: 6 		Post Options Post Options   Quote SamM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jan 12 at 6:54am
Originally posted by CharlieW505

Doug H,
 
Interesting you mention fair handicaps.  I note that the f/ball sailors had both 1st and last places in the same race..!!  That hints at good handicapping.  The 505's too had a good spread (just 2 boats, but both competitive crews a couple of minutes apart).
 
Actually the results for the mid-handicap (race 1) suggest that it was very close, and therefore well handicapped.  1 minute 10 seconds covered 3-13th places.  Race 2 looks like it spread out a bit more - as it was longer.  Perhaps the 505 (Tim Rush) got clear on the 1st beat?
 
In any case, impressive stuff on the PY's.
 
 
C
 
I wonder why these numbers are so impossible for the RYA to get to.  Is it because the circuit sailors are not substantially part of the return.............
 
 
 

We (Fireballs) weren't far behind Tim on the first beat, but he was able to get away down the run because the 2nd race paid to high wire (sail the angles) downwind and stay in the narrow wind bands. There should have been enough breeze for the Fireballs to be able to do it too, but it wasn't paying - I think because you could sail out of the narrow bands of wind too quickly, and to stay in them would have required a lot of gybes (and therefore be slow). Tim was certainly sailing very well though and looked impressive as he was sailing away from us...

Your point about the Ospreys is interesting - when we lined up against them directly upwind they were sailing a lot higher and faster than us and we were going broadly the same speed downwind. Their handicap is a bit faster than ours, but I think the main reason we stayed ahead was that we started a bit better and got the shifts right a bit more. I don't know if Ospreys are harder to tack than Fireballs and if that makes a difference.

Does anyone have a link to the corrected times yet? Would be interesting to see
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