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jeffers View Drop Down
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    Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 6:31pm
Originally posted by Roger

<snip>, and I'd be very surprised it there wasn't more video which has been held back too Wink
 
It is quite telling the the ISAF channel on YouTube has daily summaries for all days except day 10. There is mention of the IJ role in the Day 11 summary in the preview to the Finn medal race.
 
The coverage (at least on the 25 minute shows) looks pretty good, lots of GPS tracking and graphics to illustrate where the key players are and some pretty good filming too. Even if some of it is a little misleading.
 
Be interesting to see the lessons learnt from this for the media side. Given the equipment available to media people there should be no need to be right close in unless they are performing a post race interview (perhaps thats why the boat did not get the hell out of there after the race?).
 
Yes yes I have read about the SIs saying that media boats will be on the course and are not required to stay out of the way, that, IMO, definitely needs to be addressed and the media boat drivers should be thoroughly briefed as to the effects they can have even inadvertantly. Perhaps having RIB drivers who also sail might help here?
 
Time will tell, i am sure there is still much to be said on this issue but I doubt we will hear about the media side just the 'public' side if the RYA/ISAF decide to that a hearing and further snctions are warranted.
 
 
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Posts: 3958 		Post Options Post Options   Quote winging it Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 5:23pm
Roger, I'm not going to argue with you, I'm just going to state that I have been sponsored as a sailor myself, so I know exactly how it works, I work for a sports NGB - a fairly major one - under contract, so I know how major sponsorship deals work, and I live with someone who will be on the pitch inside the Olympic stadium as a Field Judge for both the Olympics and Paralympic.  Said person has as part of their duties ensuring that no sponsorship is visible apart from what is allowed, so I have a pretty good idea of that too.

Oh, and yes, I have seen an athlete run into a photographer.  as I said, they're all over the place.
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Posts: 1151 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 2547 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 4:32pm
Originally posted by furtive

Facts found in the protest decision report. Based on the evidence presented they concluded that Ben didn't punch anyone.


yes yes, we all know that the facts found are not always the facts ... the good news is that all parties seem to be keen to diffuse this with as little fuss as possible; good spin control by the RYA Wink

However, you don't bother boarding another craft in anger just to have words and those pictures show "contact" and people opposite BA recoiling backwards ...
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Posts: 705 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Steve411 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 4:20pm
Originally posted by winging it

Much as I sympathsie with Ben I feel he will - and should - take further punishment for this.  No matter what the situation, or who you are, you can't just climb into someone else's boat and give them a fairly robust piece of your mind.  It's just not acceptable. 

The RYA and his sponsors have made Ben the 'poster boy' of the dinghy sailing world, and 100s of kids up and down the country will have his picture on their wall.  These kids will know what he has done and they need to see action taken against him, as it would be against any other sailor, and rightly so.

What I notice from my morning's perusal of facebook over my ready brek, is how many of my young sailing friends have instantly befriended Giles Scott.  I wonder if Ben is now yesterday's man? 
 
That's because he is now world champ and children love winners - that's why so many of them support Man Utd, Chelsea et al rather than the local club.
 
I have to say, Ben Ainslie has gone up in my opinion after this. Good on him for venting his feeling (even if, in hindsight, he wish he hadn't). I once nearly landed in the back of a photographer's boat going downwind because he left it far too late to get out of the way.
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Posts: 524 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Roger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 4:16pm
Originally posted by seamonkey

Originally posted by JimC

... he seems to have managed to refrain from throwing punches.


How do you know that;  have you seen any video?

In the photo sequence here http://www.sailingpix.dk/image/I00002vfUZc3w4Hw he clearly "lays hands" on the driver & the guy in the bow and looking at the photo sequence it looks like he's chinned the guy in the bow with a nice left cross ... of course you can't really tell from the still but that is how it looks.

If he just wanted words that could have been done from his own boat.

I suspect ISAF are playing it down as they don't want to be examined for the intrusion of the media boat ...




 
 
I would say it looks like he's stepping over the guy in the front of the boat so he can dive off the bow..    and thats all...
 
Just looking at the stills is always going to be missleading and we shouldn't jump to any conclusions, although if he did throw punches then I have no doubt it would have come out by now..... Wink there must be plenty of witnesses, and I'd be very surprised it there wasn't more video which has been held back too Wink
 
 
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Posts: 978 		Post Options Post Options   Quote rogue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 4:10pm
Originally posted by furtive

(Statement on this process from the RYA is on the front page now).


yep- they're beginning to distance themselves to create a facade of impartiality....
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Posts: 524 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Roger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 4:07pm
Originally posted by winging it

In athletics camera men are all over the field of play. The close up shots you see pre a 100m start are filmed about one foot away from the athlete's face until they are on their marks.
Of course they are, but thats before the race starts!!!!!!
You dont see them standing 50m away down lane 5 forcing the athlete to run round them?????
Originally posted by winging it


"I would also say that I am not privvy to the arrangements made with Ben's sponsors or anybody elses for that matter, do the sponsors actually expect high level TV coverage to the non sailor? I doubt that very much (but they got it over the weekend), they probably expect a little to the sailing public, and the use of their athlete in the printed press, internet adverts and for the athlete to carry out a set amount of PR appearances each year."

Of course they expect tv coverage, and any other kind of coverage. They won't be shelling out their hard earned cash purely out of the goodness of their hearts; they expect/demand a return.

My post quite clearly states that they expect a payback, I just dont believe that they are expecting prime time TV coverage, this is not the Americas Cup.
Unless you say otherwise I'm assuming you have not read Ben Ainslie's contract with any of his sponsors, I know I haven't, but I have in the past had some involvement is sponsorship of competitors in minor sport, from the corporate view point.
The value comes in many ways and often the ability to have pictures of said competitor in your branded gear, or logo on their equipment is very valuable, running to tens thousands pounds worth. Get that athlete to give a couple of motivational talks to staff, a couple of corporate events they speak at and you have tens thousands more value, then use them in your advertising and the value increases further, it's not all about TV coverage.
If by chance you get some prime time coverage it's often a bonus, and it's not unknown for athletes to have bonuses if they do get extra coverage, same as bonuses for winning events as this by definition gives extra coverage.
Originally posted by winging it


"Remember there will be no sponsors logo's at the Olympic Event, infact no mention of sponsors at all."

True in that the only logos the athletes can display will be those of their kit maker, but otherwise the whole event will e full of logos and advertising. Famous athletes are already advertising their sponsors role in supporting the games eg Jessica Ennis and BP, and they will continue to do so throughout the Games, primarily on tv.

Those with connections to the main olympic sponsors will be very valuable, thats why the likes of BP, Visa, Omega, BMW, McDonalds etc have signed them up, but Olympic rules are very very strict, its event sponsors only that will get the coverage in stadia and around event sites, and they are quite rightly being clever about who they sign up.
In the UK Olympic TV coverage will come from the BBC, with some Eurosport coverage too, Eurosport will be the only commercial TV channel to have any Olympic coverage in the UK.
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Posts: 188 		Post Options Post Options   Quote furtive Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 3:49pm
Facts found in the protest decision report. Based on the evidence presented they concluded that Ben didn't punch anyone. Unless new evidence is presented the hearing won't get re-opened and therefore the facts won't change. All that's left now is whether the RYA (and if not then ISAF) choose to take any further action based on the report that they'll receive from the Jury. (Statement on this process from the RYA is on the front page now).
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Posts: 1151 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 2547 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 3:38pm
Originally posted by JimC

... he seems to have managed to refrain from throwing punches.


How do you know that;  have you seen any video?

In the photo sequence here http://www.sailingpix.dk/image/I00002vfUZc3w4Hw he clearly "lays hands" on the driver & the guy in the bow and looking at the photo sequence it looks like he's chinned the guy in the bow with a nice left cross ... of course you can't really tell from the still but that is how it looks.

If he just wanted words that could have been done from his own boat.

I suspect ISAF are playing it down as they don't want to be examined for the intrusion of the media boat ...
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Posts: 3958 		Post Options Post Options   Quote winging it Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec 11 at 3:20pm
In athletics camera men are all over the field of play.  The close up shots you see pre a 100m start are filmed about one foot away from the athlete's face until they are on their marks.

"I would also say that I am not privvy to the arrangements made with Ben's sponsors or anybody elses for that matter, do the sponsors actually expect high level TV coverage to the non sailor? I doubt that very much (but they got it over the weekend), they probably expect a little to the sailing public, and the use of their athlete in the printed press, internet adverts and for the athlete to carry out a set amount of PR appearances each year."

Of course they expect tv coverage, and any other kind of coverage.  They won't be shelling out their hard earned cash purely out of the goodness of their hearts; they expect/demand a return.

"Remember there will be no sponsors logo's at the Olympic Event, infact no mention of sponsors at all." 

True in that the only logos the athletes can display will be those of their kit maker, but otherwise the whole event will e full of logos and advertising.  Famous athletes are already advertising their sponsors role in supporting the games eg Jessica Ennis and BP, and they will continue to do so throughout the Games, primarily on tv.

And yes Jim, I agree.
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