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getafix View Drop Down
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    Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 5:32pm
why all this concern about tv ratings? I just hope they pick the girls something fun.  The 49er looks like fun to me, bl**dy difficult to get right as I understand it (never sailed one) but none the less, a bit of a grin, girls deserve something decently quick after the Yngling  Dead
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Posts: 134 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Stevie_GTI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 5:24pm
Originally posted by johnreekie1980

I like the look of the boat and think it is a welcome addition as i did not think that the 29erxx really had the weight carrying capability or the length for the new rig. I would not like to see a 800 at the games as I don't think it is a revolutionary design that the 49er was in its day. God luck to you ovingtons.
The RS800 isn't even being put forward for the slot
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Posts: 241 		Post Options Post Options   Quote fudheid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 3:35pm
Originally posted by Chris 249

[QUOTE=ham4sand]


Has anyone EVER produced an evidence-based argument that shows we should be chucking "mainstream" classes out of the limelight in favour of faster boats? Yep, we get the old "the IOC wants higher ratings" line, but that's never backed up by evidence (as far as I have seen) that faster boats get more TV. And there's no evidence that "radical" boats are the future (they are a small minority EVERYWHERE, even when they get massive commercial and club support), or that bringing in skiff types won't hurt the other things the IOC requires from Olympic sports, like strong universal appeal.


I think the ac45's where on TV they count as a new, fast, sexy format? Surely F1 cars encourage boys to kart and take up cheaper motorsports, why then can sailing not.
i can remember seeing 18ftrs when i started (before they had wings) and dreaming of sailing them - it took a while but it encouraged me and my crew who was a windsurfer into dinghies.....

doesn't matter what if more people sail whoop whoop!
PS i don't think it shouldn't be split into girls boat, why not mixed like so many other dinghies
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 2:38pm

Evidence based reasoning?!!

Are you mad sir!!  Next you'll be telling us that we SHOULDN'T believe everything that's printed in the Sun paper.  
I'm afraid this is a forum and NOT a place for fact based decision making!  You clearly haven't got the hang of this at all.  

Wink

Doug


Edited by Doug.H - 20 Oct 11 at 2:39pm
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 1:51pm
Originally posted by ham4sand

i do think that the golf analogy is a bit rubbish. if there was only one type of equipment, for argument call it a laser, i wouldnt still be sailing

Yeah, but if you didn't sail and I didn't sail, yet we were replaced by 10 people who DID sail because the sport seemed cheaper, easier and more accessible, then arguably the sport would be stronger.

But I never said that the sport SHOULD ban or discourage high-performance classes, which are fantastic - I've spent a lot of time on very fast kit myself and loved it. The point is that the repeated claims to the effect that the future of the sport is fast boats, or that we should promote the sport best by highlighting radical classes, doesn't seem to have any basis in reality.

Has anyone EVER produced an evidence-based argument that shows we should be chucking "mainstream" classes out of the limelight in favour of faster boats? Yep, we get the old "the IOC wants higher ratings" line, but that's never backed up by evidence (as far as I have seen) that faster boats get more TV. And there's no evidence that "radical" boats are the future (they are a small minority EVERYWHERE, even when they get massive commercial and club support), or that bringing in skiff types won't hurt the other things the IOC requires from Olympic sports, like strong universal appeal.

We've got hype, but it's just empty without facts - especially when you can produce a strong argument to say that what the sport needs is more concentration on the accessible boats that the vast majority of people actually sail.

And it IS a fact that there are many sports in which the pros use gear similar to the stuff the average competitor uses that ARE more popular than sailing. That's not rubbish, that's the truth. If those sports that make specific rules and efforts to make pros use what amateurs can use are wrong, why are they so much more popular than sailing?

If we are goiing to risk hurting the sport and its place in the Games and chucking out established classes, shouldn't we have at least an evidence-based reason for doing so?


Edited by Chris 249 - 20 Oct 11 at 1:55pm
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 1:41pm
Originally posted by Rupert

If the skiff is all but dead in Australia, does that mean the rest of the world can have the name back without being shouted at?

Only if the term is given back to the French and Germans, who created it! Big smile
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 1:40pm
Originally posted by rogue

 

Language morphs over time and geography- it's just one of those curious little things about the human experience that anthropology has yet to find a really good explanation for.

As for this boat- well it meets the design brief well enough on paper, will it make sailing better to watch... doubt it personally, but then I find most sailing pretty uninteresting and uninspiring to watch, so wtf do I know?


Yep, languager does change, and proof of that is the way that (for example) ther18 Footers, which once used "skiff" as an insult, are now sometimes so protective of it. So sure, the concept can chsnge; all I'm saying is that is DOES have an identifiable historical heritage and meaning and that (like any word) if used too widely it becomes less meaningful and useful.

I can only agree with your reservations about whether boats like this will lead to more people watching sailing to any real extent (or at least, to people watching sailing and therefore deciding to take it up).
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rogerd View Drop Down
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Posts: 1076 		Post Options Post Options   Quote rogerd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 12:37pm
Originally posted by NickA


Flashy colour, looks like it'll sink tho.  
 
Surely if its a girls boat its the wrong colour.
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Posts: 20 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Dan MPS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 11:56am
There looks to have been a few changes to when I last saw it a few months ago. It looks like they have gone for the same racks as the Musto, where as when i saw it last if had some beautiful aerofoiled carbon racks. Nicest looking boat i have seen. Well Done Ovington
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Posts: 91 		Post Options Post Options   Quote johnreekie1980 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Oct 11 at 10:20am
I like the look of the boat and think it is a welcome addition as i did not think that the 29erxx really had the weight carrying capability or the length for the new rig. I would not like to see a 800 at the games as I don't think it is a revolutionary design that the 49er was in its day. God luck to you ovingtons.
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