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ChrisC View Drop Down
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    Posted: 23 Apr 11 at 9:21pm
Greame,

To further totally rubbish your point - check this out:

http://www.starcrossyc.org.uk/RaceManager6/results/Frostbite11-CS2-20110327-659-11.htm

Wind was 5 to 8 knots, just enough to hike against with the 10.2. Michael had me nailed on elapsed until a lucky just just before the finish allowed me to sneek through. Not only did all three 100's (2 on 8.4's) have a huge win on corrected we were actually beating the faster boats on the water for much of the race. Not a fag packet between the 8.4 and 10.2.

And as a final contradiction on the 100's ability in handicap racing check this out:

http://www.starcrossyc.org.uk/RaceManager6/results/series/FROSTBITE11.htm

Races sailed in a full range of conditions from drifters to 40K.

You cant argue with facts !

Hey Ho.

C
Not now Kato (you fewl) !

RS100 421 (8.4)
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Ex - 49er NZL142 (crew)
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haroosh View Drop Down
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Posts: 521 		Post Options Post Options   Quote haroosh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 11 at 10:48pm
Originally posted by G.R.F.

Well my problem is compounded by the sort of courses we sail, which even though we've go the whole of the bloody English Channel to stretch our legs across, seem to end up the inevitable fetch fetch run with a lucky day being able to use the kite on two of the legs. <div id="myWatcherDiv" style="display:none;">
On another subject, I put a new kite halyard on today, supplied by RS, it's a lot shorter than the one originally fitted, seems to work better as well, stays under tension.


It might be worth asking your fellow club sailors for the occasional course that suits you asymmetric boat. It's quite unusual to not have other asymetrics to race against in clubs these days????
Keith
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rushy View Drop Down
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Posts: 44 		Post Options Post Options   Quote rushy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 11 at 10:08am
A question aimed at our "larger" helms, how do you fare in the 100 when using the big sail against the average sized guys using either sail, average to me means about 12-14st and larger up to 18st. This is an inquiry for a seriously interested guy who dosen't want to feel unnecessarily handicaped by his weight. Technique and sailing ability aside. Cheers.
Incidently I'm 12 he's 18. stones that is!
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AndrewLB View Drop Down
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Posts: 109 		Post Options Post Options   Quote AndrewLB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 11 at 10:33pm
hi Rushy,

i think it depends on the course being sailed and conditions. the 'average' bloke in a big rig will be dumping power earlier on and may struggle more on a RTC course with some single sail reaches. i think we've shown that above 10kts on a W/L course there's no definable difference between the rigs, below 10kts the big rig may have a slight edge.

and contrary to what GRF is blathering about, there isn't that significant difference between the two sails for performance. the 8.4 is clearly not a dog in light winds, check the results from the QM open; saturday was 12-15kts, sunday was 8-12kts and the top 4 were made up of two of each.

i'm also intrigued as to what "lighter conditions" GRF is looking for to have this big rig race, with his ever-decreasing bodyweight his 'no hiking' rule must limit it to 5kts?!!?
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paolochilds View Drop Down
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Posts: 36 		Post Options Post Options   Quote paolochilds Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 11 at 9:25am
Hi Rushy.

We had a great weekend race at HISC. We had Andrew(??kgs), Myself (95kgs), Nick P (98kgs) and Simon Childs (106kgs). Up the first beat it was quite interesting to see how we gained/lost out to each other in a straight line. It was gusty and about 8-12kts, the small changes made a littble bit of a difference but at the WW mark (After a LONG beat) Nick, Andrew and Si were nose to tail and I was about 20metres behind.

Downwind I think we were fairly matched for speed but running against the tide so it was tricky whether the tide/breeze made more difference. I think it ended up with the breeze making a bigger difference. At the bottom of the run I just about led Nick and Si. Andrew decided to cool off with a dip ;-)

I think that there is little difference overall and that on a ww/lw course the rigs are pretty similar and that weight doesn't seam to matter too much either. However I do agree with Andrew that on a 1 sail reach the 10.2 does appear to be a bit quicker while you are not overpowered.

To top this all off after a pretty light Queen Mary Alex M showed us where to go. He said he was weighing in at a big 110kgs whereas we had lighter sailors Clive E and Chris L (In the 80kgs bracket) not able to stay with him upwind but a tad faster downhill.

It seams that there isn't much in it at this time...

Paul


Edited by paolochilds - 27 Apr 11 at 9:27am
Paul Childs
RS Sailing
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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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Posts: 4028 		Post Options Post Options   Quote G.R.F. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 11 at 10:36am
Originally posted by AndrewLB



i'm also intrigued as to what "lighter conditions" GRF is looking for to have this big rig race, with his ever-decreasing bodyweight his 'no hiking' rule must limit it to 5kts?!!?

My 'threshold' for ceasing to be 'effective' using the big rig is 8 knots, now last I looked 8 knots is a force 3.
Now, there are two forces less than that, in which you'll find me a serious problem to compete against with an 8.4, in fact I'd go as far as to say even Ben Ainslee or Paul Goodison would struggle against the might of Grumpf with a 10.2. if all they had were 8.4's. and 5 knots being officially a light breeze and what I describe as light wind were in play. (Which happens often on summer evening series)

I would however agree that once 10 knots is happening there is little discernible difference, unless of course one is seriously Phantom sailor build, the biggest advantage of the 8.4 is the lighter weight and lower centre of gravity with the mast down which makes the boat easier to handle.

However the 8.4 remains not a nice sail in 5 knots imvho. as tight leeched multi batten sails made of laminate often are and is why it is as competitive with the 10.2 in 10 knots and above, precisely because the 10.2 blades off nicely and dumps area in a very smooth way, it's a much nicer sail, pity I'm not just a bit heavier and a pity they didn't cut the 8.4 with a tad more negative luff curve in the head.




Edited by G.R.F. - 27 Apr 11 at 10:38am
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haroosh View Drop Down
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Posts: 521 		Post Options Post Options   Quote haroosh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 11 at 10:42am
Our evening series starts tonight and fc is looking light so my conditions. 8.4 all the way..............
Keith
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AndrewLB View Drop Down
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Posts: 109 		Post Options Post Options   Quote AndrewLB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 11 at 11:51am
Originally posted by paolochilds


At the bottom of the run I just about led Nick and Si. Andrew had to duck the back of a slow moving Childs Snr and got wet doing so which really spoilt his birthday :-(


There you go Paul, fixed it for you. I'm also 95kg (is nick really 98kg??). Looking forward to what could be a stellar evening race tonight; high tide, decent breeze, sunshine.
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AlexM View Drop Down
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Posts: 857 		Post Options Post Options   Quote AlexM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 11 at 12:12pm
Originally posted by paolochilds


To top this all off after a pretty light Queen Mary Alex M showed us where to go. He said he was weighing in at a big 110kgs whereas we had lighter sailors Clive E and Chris L (In the 80kgs bracket) not able to stay with him upwind but a tad faster downhill.

 
How very dare you.... that's confidetial information Wink A little bit of holiday weight Big smile
 
First wed night sail at my new club tonight, looking light but hoping the 100 easter training day comes in handy Tongue  Hopefully we get a WW/LW course
 
Alex
 
 
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paolochilds View Drop Down
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Posts: 36 		Post Options Post Options   Quote paolochilds Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 11 at 12:17pm
That is what he claimed before sailing. I believe him, he is shorter than all of us!

Yeah it was very bad of Dad to make you go for a swim  LOL

GRF, I am de-powering in 8kts, so surely you would be more efficient in an 8.4 with less drag and de-powering less?? When I sailed at QM I thought the 8.4 was fine. in the light and breeze I was just as quick. Just those marginal hiking, where my beer belly slowed me down too much!! 
Paul Childs
RS Sailing
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