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Foiling for the masses

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Poll Question: If it was available would you?
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Menace View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Menace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Foiling for the masses
    Posted: 10 Jan 11 at 5:29pm

I thought something similar about the 600FF, but it's not really easy enough to be the "mass foiler" that seems to tick all the boxes mentioned. I don't really get the foiler for the masses thing as the compromises you will be making don't really go hand in hand with the type of boat. 

If you (not targeted at you Bob) want to foil, put the work in, endure the learning curve and gain the reward at the end of the day.  If you want to be competitive in other athletic sports you go to the gym to raise your game, why does sailing have to be any different? 
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mattb669 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 11 at 12:25pm
for all the talk, try the blaze xf advertised on the ca site for £3750.
Ticks some of the boxes !
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Skiffybob View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Skiffybob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 11 at 12:31pm
Ticks all the boxes except the crucial "for the masses" one.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mattb669 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 11 at 1:28pm
And your contribution to the possibility of seeing anthing other than a moth or 600 foiling would be ?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 11 at 1:38pm
How did that go? Did it foil?
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Mattb669 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mattb669 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 11 at 1:45pm
Sadly i never got that far, not very well at the mo so im going to pass on to someone else to complete. Would still love to see it fly. Its virtually ready to go for sea trials and tweaking.
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb 11 at 11:08pm
One thing I still wonder about foilers is how well they would have managed if Bladerider hadn't lost about a million pounds doing a fabulous job promoting them and selling them at a loss.  

Since we can't expect many manufacturers to lose about 5,000 GBP per boat over about 400 units (if my memory of vague back-of-the-envelope guesses is right) we also can't expect that sort of launch for many other new craft.  Having someone take that sort of financial loss (and much of the loss was felt by their contractors and suppliers as far as I know) to support a class means it's in a very special category when it comes to artificially low prices and artificially high levels of promotion - until the cash runs out.

Interestingly, the real "breakthrough" mass-market boats of earlier generations (Laser, Windsurfer, J/24, Hobie... huge in most of the sailing world if not always in the UK) all came from bargain-basement operations.  The Hobie seemed to be the best-funded one, with funds of about 80,000 pounds in today's values.  The Laser is the boat it is because of the funding it DIDN'T have, which forced the trio who built it to abandon plans to compete with the Sunfish.  With the ease of modern marketing on the net, perhaps it could be even easier to launch a product now, if it really did grab the mass market's imagination at the right price - which IMHO foilers don't seem to do.

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Menace View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Menace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 11 at 8:49am
That's the fundamental problem though, if you try to make a niche high end product attractive to the masses, you are always going to lose out. The knock on effect of the Bladerider loss will make others think twice about even attempting something similar in the future and may be a reason itself that there hasn't been an explosion of foiling boats as people may have initially thought was going to happen a few years ago.  
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 11 at 8:56am
The reason for a lack of explosion in foiling boats is simple. Even moderately good sailors look at them, think "wow" and then carry on sailing boats they know they can sail without needing to sail day in day out for months to master, and can sail on a weed infested pond without going over the handlebars.
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Pierre View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Pierre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb 11 at 9:08am
Agree with Rupert, and would also add that you need a decent expanse of water to play nicely with foilers. Laraping round on most inland waters really isn't an option due to limited space.

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