New Posts New Posts RSS Feed: Debunking Dodgy Sailing Theories
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Debunking Dodgy Sailing Theories
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 9>
Author
  Share Topic Share Topic  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
I luv Wight View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 28 Jan 05
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 628 		Post Options Post Options   Quote I luv Wight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Debunking Dodgy Sailing Theories
    Posted: 29 Dec 11 at 10:35pm
Originally posted by RS400atC

Originally posted by Peaky


The rudder will always have drag, just like the centreboard. A light helm does not mean no drag, it just means it is better balanced.


A rudder that is continuously providing lift to counteract weather helm will create more drag than one which is not.


A rudder that is continuously providing lift to counteract weather helm will create more drag than one which is not, BUT it will reduce the lift and drag from the centreboard.

http://www.bloodaxeboats.co.uk
Andy P
foiling Int Moth GBR3467
Freedom 21 Codling
Back to Top
RS400atC View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 04 Dec 08
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3011 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Dec 11 at 7:16pm
Originally posted by Peaky


The rudder will always have drag, just like the centreboard. A light helm does not mean no drag, it just means it is better balanced.


A rudder that is continuously providing lift to counteract weather helm will create more drag than one which is not.
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest Group
Guest Group
Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Dec 11 at 10:51pm
Originally posted by zippyRN


Originally posted by Contender443

I think we are talking more about balance here. What you think of as flat is usually a slight heel to leeward and windward heel to you is probably flat.
 

If your rudder is set up properly then a flat boat will give neutral helm and therefore no drag.

 exactly ...

The rudder will always have drag, just like the centreboard. A light helm does not mean no drag, it just means it is better balanced.

Edited by Peaky - 28 Dec 11 at 10:51pm
Back to Top
JohnW View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 17 Jul 07
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 552 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JohnW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 11 at 11:01am
Originally posted by zippyRN

 

(some) pond sailors will sail if there's one wind ripple per square metre of water's surface 

That's blowing a hoolie on our lake! 

The other week the race was run (by popular request) when the only ripples were caused by fish jumping and ducks swimming!  (and it was foggy).

I was glad I was on race duty that day.

I dont recall how many boats had their clew outhaul on hard though.
Back to Top
zippyRN View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work


Joined: 14 Sep 06
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 437 		Post Options Post Options   Quote zippyRN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 11 at 11:48pm
Originally posted by Contender443

I think we are talking more about balance here. What you think of as flat is usually a slight heel to leeward and windward heel to you is probably flat.
 
If your rudder is set up properly then a flat boat will give neutral helm and therefore no drag.

 exactly ...
Back to Top
zippyRN View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work


Joined: 14 Sep 06
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 437 		Post Options Post Options   Quote zippyRN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 11 at 11:46pm
Originally posted by RS400atC

<snip>
Also, what some people call 'light' others are thinking, 'let's postpone until the wind arrives'. I'm thinking about those days when we struggle to make progress at all against the tide.


(some) pond sailors will sail if there's one wind ripple per square metre of water's surface or less, where in tidal waters you 'd just be being pushed around by the tide 
Back to Top
zippyRN View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work


Joined: 14 Sep 06
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 437 		Post Options Post Options   Quote zippyRN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Dec 11 at 11:44pm
Originally posted by craiggo

Depending on sail cut, the outhaul has differing effects. On most sails it can only be used to control the draught of the lower 1/3 of the sail. The amount of travel needed on a skiff outhaul is small as generally the rig is pretty powerful and controlling the top and middle sections with cunningham and kicker is more critical.
In general though for light wind sailing it is essential to keep the flow attached to the sail, and too much draught can lead to the flow running out of energy leading to seperation. A tight outhaul while sailing a little free-er will ensure minimum drag but max forward drive.

exactly keeping flow attached , it also depends, as you say on the rig  - with the extremes of the laser / topper style shroudless una rig  at one end  and the all singing all dancing 27 pieces of string  of a merlin or somesuch at the other  as to what influence the outhaul and  the cunningham has - basically by what opposes it's actions 
Back to Top
SoggyBadger View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 26 Oct 10
Location: The Wild Wood
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 552 		Post Options Post Options   Quote SoggyBadger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 11 at 7:08pm
Originally posted by Roger

hence canting rigs to windward in Melins (recently)


Kevin Haynes was doing that in the 70s, which is recent on a geological scale of course Wink
Best wishes from deep in the woods

SB

Back to Top
themeaningoflife View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work
Avatar

Joined: 06 May 11
Location: Essex/ Kent
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 212 		Post Options Post Options   Quote themeaningoflife Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 11 at 6:30pm
Plus if a gust hits when the boat is heeled to windward, as it comes flat it is in the best position to accelerate from and thus more speed and height!
Cambridge University Lightweight Rowing Club
RS800 1128

kindly sponsored by RWO Marine
Back to Top
Rupert View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 11 Aug 04
Location: Whitefriars sc
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 11 at 5:38pm
One of the Rooster vids goes into it in some detail. Easier to see it happening than to explain, at least for me...
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 9>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.665y
Copyright ©2001-2010 Web Wiz
Change your personal settings, or read our privacy policy