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Amateur Sailor of the Year |
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jaydub 
Far too distracted from work 
Joined: 06 Jan 07 Online Status: Offline Posts: 267 |
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 Topic: Amateur Sailor of the YearPosted: 13 Dec 18 at 11:11pm |
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Well said, Tom. Maria's achievement is fantastic. Sailing a 200 I know how good you have to be even to win on the regional circuits. To dominate the 200s at National level is a in the way she has is a fantastic achievement
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Posted: 13 Dec 18 at 3:47pm |
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I think you have to look beyond the results though. Like I said before, just getting a good result doesn't really carry for a top award. There has to be something extra. Mike Senior and Chris White (campaigning an old boat, class stalwarts & 'comeback' win... all things they had equal part in). Grennan, Hodges & Cattermole, again, the element that clearly makes their achievement more remarkable is the additional challenges faced by being blind in our sport, again, a shared element.
So, when I read the blurb on Maria, it's pretty clear the additional element to her success which makes it's noteworthy is that she's female helm. Rob isn't a female helm. He's not had to overcome being physically smaller, he's not had to work against stereotypes that women shouldn't be competitive, or that men make better helms. And, if you don't really believe those are real barriers that Maria has overcome, then just from a historical point of view it's not as rare for a male crews to win a nationals. Winning the UKs (arguably) most competitive adult amateur fleet as a female helm is Maria's 'story', not Robs. The others had shared stories which made the joint nominations more obvious. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for crew getting recognition in a sporting context. He's national champ just as much as Maria, he has equal right to prizes and standing on the podium. But, the element that makes Maria's story remarkable, isn't true for Rob. Having said, I wouldn't have object had rob been on the nomination but I can see a rationale for why he isn't. |
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Rupert
Really should get out more 
Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Posted: 13 Dec 18 at 2:44pm |
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Given the others are paired, it does seem odd.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Fatboi
Posting king 
Joined: 09 Aug 16 Location: Hampshire Online Status: Offline Posts: 189 |
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Posted: 13 Dec 18 at 12:55pm |
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I think a lady helm winning is fantastic and should be celebrated! She is the first and hopefully not the last lady helm to win the 200s and that is a fantastic achievement, however she did not do it on her own. She had a crew, who contributed to the success of her season and I think that is worthy of being noted and the nomination.
You can bet if she had another lady crewing that they would be on the list with her, so why not her crew no matter the sex?!
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Posted: 13 Dec 18 at 12:42pm |
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A lady helm winning is quite rare, so much so it makes it quite news worthy. There are lots of people winning events each year, so to be nominated I think there has to be something extra to the story. There's a whole ridiculous PC argument and counter argument about why a female helm winning is notable and whether recognising it as notable is sexist or feminist. There have been male crews winning the nationals. It's probably not as common as female crews in the 200 fleet, but in most classes it's very common. So, while Rob's results this year are similar to Maria's (no Inlands or Endeavour) I don't think it's as notable. On the other hand, it takes top crews like Rob, who might on their day fancy their chances as helms themselves, to step up to crew for the top women. And Rob is the first crew to win a nationals with a lady helm... And before Maria he sailed with Frances who was the first female helm to get a podium at 200 nationals. So, there's an argument Rob has potentially done more for the results of female helms in the 200 fleet than anyone!
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davidyacht
Really should get out more
Joined: 29 Mar 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1345 |
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Posted: 13 Dec 18 at 12:01pm |
I raised this point on P2 and was rebuffed by Mozzy. I think that the argument was that Maria is not a bloke, and that is why she should stand alone. I think that it is great that a lady has won, but I can never work out whether positive discrimination is misogynistic or not?!? On other posts I have been rebuffed when making the case for mixed classes because women struggle to compete having lower muscle density, so especially well none to Maria. However, I remain of the view that a helm is only as good as their crew and therefore the crew should always get equal credit.
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Happily living in the past
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Fatboi
Posting king
Joined: 09 Aug 16 Location: Hampshire Online Status: Offline Posts: 189 |
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Posted: 13 Dec 18 at 11:02am |
Yeah, but she would not have been able to do as well without her crew that she has sailed the last 2 years with, so by not crediting them or even mentioning either is an absolute shambles!
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iGRF
Really should get out more
Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6499 |
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Posted: 13 Dec 18 at 10:28am |
That's it, now I remember I was supposed to go to LA it was the first year windsurfing was in the Olympics probably how i met her back in 79- 80 when they were teeing up who should go. She was good, if you think it's tough now getting your foot in the door as a woman it was a whole different story back then, bloody good sailer Cathy and fit as the proverbial butchers hound. Looked her up on FB looks like she's some sort of life coach these days, good on her. |
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Rupert
Really should get out more
Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Posted: 12 Dec 18 at 10:11pm |
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In LA in 84 Cathy Foster sailed a 470 with Pete Newlands.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Hitcher
Newbie 
Joined: 21 Dec 10 Online Status: Offline Posts: 38 |
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Posted: 12 Dec 18 at 6:46pm |
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Rob Henderson crewed for Maria at the Nationals, and usually sails with her. Alan Roberts sailed with her at the Inlands and the Endeavour.
I think it has been discussed on this forum, possibly earlier in this thread. Both who her crews were, and why it was just her that was nominated. Pete Newlands.
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