Laser 161752 Tynemouth |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Trapwing Prototype |
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Doug Lord ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 03 Sep 05 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 66 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 11 May 10 at 4:06am |
This is a unique design that uses ballast in a sealed wing in several different versions. Pictures are of a model of the prototype.
Here are some details: The following is a detailed look at the characteristics of the new Prototype, as well as the design elements it will encompass and test: ----- Trapwing Prototype: LOA 17' 8"(5.38m) Beam hull-3.25'(1 m) overall 12'(3.66m)(subject to testing) Weight- hull 155lb ballast-wing 80lb(36.3kg)-180lb(81.8kg)(variable and subject to testing) keel 0-80lb(36.3kg)(subject to testing)dinghy version-no keel. SA-upwind 100sq.ft(9.3sq.m)-180sq.ft(16.7 sq.m) variable downwind 200sq.ft(18.6sq.m)-360sq.ft(33.46sq.m). (variable and subject to testing) crew-singlehanded-120lb(54.5kg)-220lb(100kg) (variable and equalized under class rules- subject to testing) crew position for racing on the centerline inside boat, fixed athwhartships, variable fore and aft -------------------- 1) Sail area to be between 100sq.ft(9.3sq.m) and 180 sq.ft(16.7 sq.m) a-different rigs b-different amounts of ballast -- 2) Ballast wing to be supported by trapeze wires and unique retention system that allows wing and ballast to slide simultaneously, allows athwhartship pivoting and fore and aft movement. a-version one will use two aluminum tubes with sliding external tray- the tubes and tray move simulataneously: -attachment system allows wing- with weight centered-to be levered up and then pivoted from a position 90 degrees to the CL to a position parallel to the centerline for transport and stowage. -weight can be added or removed in small increments. -fore and aft pivot/sliding tube is mounted to the boat slightly offset from the CL to allow room to retract board/keel. -aluminum tubes terminate at outboard ends in buoyancy pods-pods will be changeable as determined in testing. -sliding ballast tray and structural design of wing to be capable of 180lb(81.8kg) max ballast @9'(2.5m) from CL; ballast completely adjustable in the range of 80(36.3kg) to 180lb(81.8kg). b-version two is a slightly curved(athwhartship), molded and sealed(with sealable access to ballast tray) wing with an internal sliding ballast tray. This version will be the final version and incorporates all the features of version one with significantly increased sealed buoyancy. c-Wing movement by manual or electric means. Minimum electrical movement speed 4' per second. Minimum electrical "stamina" on single battery-12 hours at a rate equivalent to a approximately 60 (full track)tacks per hour. -- 3) Crew Position a-version one-racing position-allows crew to sit in an extremely comfortable seat that is fixed athwhartship and slides fore and aft adjustably while sailing. -extremely wide crew weight range:for racing lower tray attached to seat may contain ballast used to equalize crew weight in the range of 120lb.(54.5kg) to 220lb.(100kg) -seat may be moved manually or electrically. b-version two-center seat is removed and two fixed carbon seats with backrests are "plugged-in" to each side deck. -- 4) Rigs to be tested are main and jib, main alone, with and without an asymetrical spinnaker. a-asymetrical will be tested as permanently mounted off a bowsprit(a la Weta tri) or retracted into a trough with roller(a la Viper) and a retractable pole. b-mast to be sealed with masthead floatation in an endplate configuration. Some buoyancy possible in head of sail. -- 5)-Daggerboard/ keel/rudder a -boat will be tested with and without a retractable "lifting keel" which would essentially be a carbon daggerboard with the minimum ballast required(determined in testing) to right the boat from a pitchpole(where the wing buoyancy may not significantly help). b-self-righting from a knockdown or pitchpole is a required design element for any version of the boat used for disabled sailing. c-a turbo version of the boat will not use a ballasted keel and may not be suitable for disabled sailing but this will be determined in testing. d- the daggerboard may include as standard a lifting hydrofoil designed to provide "foil-assist" to reduce wetted surface and in conjunction with the rudder hydrofoil improve the pitch and planing characterstics of the boat. e-a fully flying hydrofoil system will be tested as will a fully flying system that allows the boat to fly downwind only(requiring less upwind SA and less ballast). f-rudder will be retractable with a t-foil. -- 6)-On the Beach a-the boat will be able to be easily beach sailed with a dolly incorporated into the trailer design to make it very simple to go from trailer to water. A "power assist" dolly may be available. -- 7)-Performance a- the goal is to develop a high performance planing sailboat that can be safely sailed from a center crew position by disabled or able-bodied sailors. I am hoping to be able to achieve an SCP/total weight of 30% or slightly better though that is just a target and a less powerfull version with numbers and performance more like a Windmill or Tasar may be perfectly acceptable. The use of foil-assist technology will help to achieve the performance goals. Full flying foiling is possible in a selfrighting boat-particularly one with the righting assist this boat has from version two of THE Wing. ------- The concept has extraordinary potential and it will be a blast finding out just what she'll do. I'd like to hear your comments...... __________________ |
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Merlinboy ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 03 Jul 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3169 |
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I don't get the wing thing?? You sit in the middle on a
chair, with a keel underneath and the boat foils??? So the wing is for what? Extra suitability? How does it work? you pull a string and it pulls the wing across for ballast? Is that not a bit cumbersome for a foiling flyer? Is there not going to be a huge amount of wind-age with that wing?? |
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Jon711 ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 04 May 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 465 |
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OMG Doug Lord is on here!!!! May have to go back to SA!!! |
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radixon ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 27 Oct 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2407 |
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Looks to me like a cross between a Challenger Dinghy and the new K1 design.
The rudder system looks like it will be out the water if there is too much lift and following on from MB, it looks like the wings will cause a balancing issue when foiling. There was a program on TV where a guy did an experiment trying to foil lift a pedelo/bike thing, (think it was bbc1 experiment program) anyway the conclusion being that too much weight stopped the thing from foiling as it wasnt able to get up to speed and foil. |
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Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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I'm guessing the idea is high performance for those of us who are too decrepid to sail moths, Musto Skiffs and the like. Isn't that what catamarans are for?! Will be an interesting concept if it works. I'm not sure a small model is going to prove it, but at least someone on here (and I include me in the masses) is doing more than doodling on paper/playing on a cad programme. Reminds me a little of the strange ideas that came from the AYRS pamphlets in the 1960's and 1970's. Most of those ideas fell by the wayside, but a few, such as foils and wing masts, have developed into things that work, as material science caught up. I'm not an SA person, though I have heard the Doug Lord name before...Remember, this is on the dinghy devlopment thread, not banter... |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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alstorer ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 02 Aug 07 Location: Cambridge Online Status: Offline Posts: 2899 |
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He managed, in a rare event, to get banned from SA... he's been promoting this idea for years, but never ever seems to get closer to actually building a full sized prototype. He once built a boat that he claimed did actually foil, but there's was no-one around to see it do so, and he sold off the bits (the hull now gets used as an ultra-stable windsurfer trainer I think). Criticise the "science" or "numbers", and you'll get personal abuse, sometimes via PM.
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Al |
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Guest ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 21 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 0 |
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Who wants to sit still in a chair in the middle of the boat, no thanks it's meant to be a physical sport.
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radixon ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 27 Oct 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2407 |
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Andymac ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 04 Apr 07 Location: Derbyshire Online Status: Offline Posts: 852 |
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Sorry, doesn't do anything for me. Looks like the paralympics on 1st April. Ballast and foiling seem to be a little contradictory, although I concede that Hydroptere probably isn't featherweight. Anyway, good luck Doug with your endeavours. Whether or not anything comes of it, it sometimes pays to think outside the box. You may discover something extraordinary on your journey. |
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Jon711 ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 04 May 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 465 |
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Fair comment Rupert, but, just wait... As I am also sure the other SA people will vouch for...... |
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