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Posting king
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Posts: 169 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Telltale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 4000 Facelift by Rooster
    Posted: 20 Jan 14 at 10:01pm

Vandercraft, RS and now Rooster have picked up ex laser designs. http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/news/174253/New-licence-holder-for-the-4000-class

 Seems as though there are changes afoot based on safety, the only safety issues I am aware of on the 4000 are its propensity to invert leading to the entrapment and the tragedy at Abersoch. Surely any modifications on that front would inevitably alter the performance.

Has to be said that in my view it is a terrific boat and its great to see it get a facelift. After look at what Rooster did for the Streaker!
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jan 14 at 10:07pm
[maybe I shouldn't be so unkind - content removed]

Edited by JimC - 20 Jan 14 at 10:08pm
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jan 14 at 10:34pm
Well this will be interesting, let's see how they go about marketing an Anti-Bandit, you couldn't get a boat other than maybe my EPS with a more un favourable handicap..
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jan 14 at 10:53pm
Given the eps at Whitefriars romped away with 2 handicap wins on Sunday, maybe you need to be looking elsewhere for excuses.

Back to the 4000, I knew loads of people who had fantastic fun sailing these boats in the late 90's. Yes, maybe the design was a little dated, but actually that made it sailable by a wider range of people than the supposedly better aussie boats.
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Posts: 323 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Neal_g Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jan 14 at 10:59pm
will the class go open sail makers I wonder
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jan 14 at 10:59pm
The demise of the 4000 was astonishingly quick. From such highs to such lows, so quickly. There's a lesson there somewhere.
For what it is worth, I strongly believe that had the 4k and ISO been more collaborative and less competitive, both would still be going strong now, albeit in updated form. Between them, the Alto and Penny 14s you could create a vibrant class of within a box rule.
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Posts: 929 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Paramedic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 14 at 8:23am
I think a massive rig and construction update must be on the agenda, but the hull shape itself - like most of the early, slightly ahead of their time and too heavy skiffs - is probably very good.

However if they don't do something with the rig and weight i can't see it competing in sales terms with the other boats in the same market sector which are at least 5 years newer and frankly will do it better.

Obviously the old boats must be grandfathered for a while to keep the existing fleet competitive for a while, but the steering group must be wanting a five year plan do drag the class into the 21st century :)
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 14 at 8:33am
What newer boats? Main competition must still be the Fireball.
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Posts: 169 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Telltale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 14 at 8:36am

So if a rig change is on the cards then light, sealed and carbon would be the answer perhaps, can that be done without altering performance? As a class the B14 made the change from aluminium to carbon, however, I think most would agree the new gear is quicker.
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Posts: 2003 		Post Options Post Options   Quote yellowwelly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 14 at 9:07am
Originally posted by Rupert

What newer boats? Main competition must still be the Fireball.

I think it remains the 800, 200, 29er, National 12, Cherub and 500.... 

Much as I've admired a lot of what Steve has done for sailing over the years, I'm somewhat dubious that this is going to work... the boat died off, the market has spoken.  Pretty much the same as what's happened when Vandercraft took over the 3000 class, and come to think of it, RS with the 2000s.... we've hardly been bowled over by the press releases from the 'marketing machine'.  In fairness to RS they have a hand tied behind their back by the old association and I guess somewhat of a conflict of interest with the 200, 400 and 500 in their proper range.

 
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