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    Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 8:58am
A small cat - Dart 15, Topaz 14?

At Soton, I saw the Hartley H12, which looks like a really nice take on a modern Mirror - rotomoulded, assy kite, one or two up etc. Not sure how well it will sell against the Feva/Pico/Topaz, but it looked good.
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Posts: 2202 		Post Options Post Options   Quote pondmonkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 9:17am
Originally posted by alstorer

Aye. Once more we hit the problem that two man boats never rerally make satisfactory single hander play things.

I have a very good friend living in France who had that very dilemma.  I recommended him a Vago and he's loving it.  He can sail it with the training dacron sails on his own or with his young son and he can sail it with other blokes using the Mylar 'race' sails- it's got a spinnaker, a trapeze (both of which are optional as the dacron reefs down) and it has nearly zero maintenance bar replacing fittings. 

It's worth noting the only racing on offer at the mountain lake he lives on, is in standard Lasers and Optimists owned by the municipality.  These are usually sailed by youths outside of ski season and from the look of it, to lower-than-average standard compared to the club scene here.  No proper adult racing at all, so racing isn't an issue for him.

If you want to race, even modestly, then follow Gordon's advice above and see what your local club(s) are sailing.  It's worth looking at more than one club if you have several in the area- an extra 10-20 minutes in the car is worth it for the better quality of sailing.  

If you follow Graeme's then good luck retaining your son in the sport.... Graeme seems to think he knows that yoof market, but the truth is if you make a teenage lad sail on the periphery of his peer group with some weird and wonderful boat that no one else sails, or indeed it is so complex it is forever breaking or capsizing, then he may well feel like a total pariah in the sport- not good.    


Edited by pondmonkey - 20 Sep 12 at 9:23am
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Posts: 2202 		Post Options Post Options   Quote pondmonkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 9:28am
Originally posted by G.R.F.

 
My advice, go to a club, find something faster and more obscure than what the local retards are using...

on this basis I might as well take a defunct class- get a custom yard to make it out of carbon, apply new rig technologies from North/Southern, add some uber-pimp foils from Bloodaxe and then hunt out an old PY Handbook from the 80's to get a totally unrealistic benchmark.  If it comes in for less than £12-15k I'll have done well.  Of course it's totally worthless bar what a breaker would offer you for all the Harken carbo-ratchets I added, but why would resale be an issue? 

You could call it a new class if you want, here's a sail insignia for you:



Edited by pondmonkey - 20 Sep 12 at 9:34am
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Posts: 129 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Owenfackrell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 9:58am
I have both a miracle and a dart 18 and i sail both singlehanded (the dart is designed to be both from the start) and 2 or more up. They are very different boats to sail and the dart is very fast. the miracle is pretty easy to sail on your own and it has proper side tanks unlike the mirror which makes sitting on them comfortable. You can get newer ones in GRP.
What sort of budget are you looking at? Ignore GRF as he wants everyone to buy only the latest things and thinks that there is no value in anything once ist past a year or 2 old.
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Posts: 521 		Post Options Post Options   Quote haroosh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 10:58am
Originally posted by gordon

So GRF wants us all to sail in the PY fleet, with boats that are brand new and lose 30% when you drive them out of the dealers yard!my I suggest a few basic truths:- good racing is one design racing;- the more boats on a one design start line the better the racing;- the more second hand boats are available the easier it is to get into the class, which means more boats racingMy advice - find a club that you like. Look at what they sail. Choose a one design class that is popular at that club that suits your budget and physique. Do not read the adverts in the glossy yachting magazines. Ignore GRF. Have fun. Only go for the high tech, publicity driven "classes" (products) if you have the money and the inclination - if you have an iPhone17, Windows 15, change your car every 6 months, leave that to (apologies for a 60s quote) the "dedicated followers of fashion". You have no obligation to support the boatbuilding industry.



Well said...
Keith
RS100 GBR 116 (XLR8)
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Posts: 20 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Seasick Steve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 6:18pm
Hey many thanks for all your replies and varied opinions, my budget is about 3 to 4K and at the moment am probably leaning towards a Laser2000 or 2 separate boats

Thanks again for all your help

Steve
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Posts: 2407 		Post Options Post Options   Quote radixon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 6:54pm
A Boat to sail solo and also with a 12 year old, don't rule out the RS Feva. Great boats and can be set up for adults. Pm me for info and pictures.
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Posts: 1037 		Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 12 at 9:14pm
My apologies to the restricted classes... aversion of one design racing that allows competitors to adapt their boats to their size (both physical and budgetary). One factor of success of Merlins, Int 14s, Cherubs, N12s etc is that design does not evolve so fast that last year's boat is obselete.

However, what future for your state of the art SMOD the day the SM decides to stop backing the boat.
others.


GRF There will always be a place for the "dedicated follower of fashion". Just don't foist your obsession for following the latest craze on
Gordon
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