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Jon711 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 2:40pm
Just been looking at the championsjip turnout table and started wondering if a better guide to a classes keeness would be to divide the amount of boats built by the amount at the championships.  I think that if this would done it would make the Squibs the keenest fleet in the country, with 97 boats and (I think) about 800 built. Is there any better way of judging a keeness of a class??
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 2:51pm
Yes.

The Olympic classes are surely the keenest of all fleets, yet only a small proportion of the ones ever built still race. The Moths and Canoes are surely fairly damn keen, but only a minute fraction of the ones ever built still race.

Personal experience is that the smaller the class, the more turn out for nationals. It's easy to understand why. If you sail a Laser etc, you can easily get 20 boats at your local club and 60 boats at a regatta. For the average sailor, that's enough - they don't need to go to the Nationals to finish 40th or 88th or whatever. So only a small proportion of the really popular classes may go to the nats.

If you sail a smaller class, where turnouts are generally poor, the nationals may be the only time you get a decent fleet - so you'll be very keen to turn up even if you are really no keener generally than those who sail popular boats.

Still, the Squibs are doing well......are their overall (club/Open fleet) numbers now eclipising the Flying 15s I like so much?
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Posts: 0 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Guest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 2:53pm

There are of course may metrics, all of which have their pros & cons ... on this one I think the Musto Skiff would beat the Squib  probably the Laser would be bottom and that is hardly an unkeen class ...

I'd like to see a table of World Championships ...

The UK scene is very unusual and it would be interesting to see which classes are active at an International level ...
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Posts: 1599 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 3:53pm

Originally posted by Jon711

Just been looking at the championsjip turnout table and started wondering if a better guide to a classes keeness would be to divide the amount of boats built by the amount at the championships.

Given that for many older classes, the majority of boats built have long since been turned into firewood, that doesn't strike me as a very useful metric.

BtW some classes have their biggest turnouts at events which are not their nationals. SB3 and XOD (Cowes Week) and Merlin Rocket (Salcombe Week) are three that come to mind.

 

 
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Posts: 345 		Post Options Post Options   Quote combat wombat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 5:53pm

Using this measure would introduce the idea that the more prolific a boat is, the more likely it is to be raced at the nationals. 

I would bet that actually the rarer the boat, the more likely it is that it will be raced at the nationals - ie the people who do own them are more likely to be enthusiasts and therefore will travel to race in one design fleets.  Musto Skiff is an exception (not taking into account my own personal opinion that the "musto revolution" may be a bubble...). 

For example there are around 150 B14's in the UK - and we got 27 to the Nationals, making that a turnout of 18% of the UK stock.  Not too bad a number I would say (as I cannot be bothered to do the maths for any other classes).

It could be used as a crude indicator of longevity but would be as unreliable as a Cherub (joke!)
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Jack Sparrow View Drop Down
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Posts: 2965 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Jack Sparrow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 6:00pm
How about membership ' v ' turnout.

Cherub = 50 something members > 24 boats at the Nationals.

That's no joke.
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Posts: 790 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chew my RS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 7:39pm

Originally posted by Chris 249


Still, the Squibs are doing well......are their overall (club/Open fleet) numbers now eclipising the Flying 15s I like so much?


I think Squibs are only sailed in a few locations and (someone correct me if i'm wrong) don't have many opens. FFs have a much broader base.

 
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Posts: 1635 		Post Options Post Options   Quote blaze720 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Oct 07 at 9:37pm
Any excuse I know .....

Blaze - 246 boats built to date - approx 25 outside UK - 44 at 2007 Nationals = 19.9%

A bit easier for us maybe as we are only 10 years old and even earliest boats can still be made competitive - Also note we did manage 53 in 2004 when approx 205 boats existed in UK = over  25% - Ask the association for a trial ...... www.blaze-sailing etc

Think the Tasar must be up there as well now and I'm sure there are others.

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Stefan Lloyd View Drop Down
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Posts: 1599 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 07 at 7:53am

707s were getting 40+ boats out of 120'ish built up until a few years ago, depending on the nationals location.
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Posts: 2143 		Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 07 at 9:53am
Nationals turnout is a good reflection of the class association and it's "health" or otherwise... dev classes put the lie to the number of competitors versus number built formula cos who'd go to the Moth Nationals with a Magnum 5, or Merlin's with a Smokers Satisfaction?

in most fleets there are probably between 5 & 10 crews who think they can win the nationals when they turn up, another 5-10 are probably there to be as competitive as possible, the rest are coming to enjoy fleet racing, get tips, see friends and spend the time with like-minded sailors - so it's a good bet that a badly organised nationals with poor off-water events will mean year-on-year poor attendance...

so look at the tables and see which classes keep a steady or growing attendance to see the ones that promote the best 'camaraderie' inside the class, even if it's turnouts in the 20-40 boat range.

ps. unless they're grumpy gits, the top 10-20 are usually there to have fun as well!
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