Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Call me suicidal but please help!!! |
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k_kirk ![]() Posting king ![]() Joined: 09 May 06 Location: Japan Online Status: Offline Posts: 172 |
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Hi, I am an overweight, mediocre sailor with a young heart. Bought myself a 29erXX rig which I shall sail in a low breeze location. This is the first time I am going to be sailing a skiff and the fastest sailing I've done so far is Laser, Hobie and some 470 about 15 years ago... How do I teach myself how to sail this thing and stay alive? I had a test sail with a sailing instrcutor at the helm and just crewing was tough work for me and I caused many swims. Please let me know if you know of any resource I can rely on to get at least the theory down pat. Thanks for your help. |
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CurlyBen ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 17 Aug 05 Location: Southampton Online Status: Offline Posts: 539 |
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Interesting choice, some people think the XX is harder to sail than the 49er, at least in some conditions! 2 options really... go on a course to learn skiff handling, or get someone who's done it before to sail with you. As far as theory goes the Higher and Faster DVD is aimed at skiff handling (in the RS800, 29er and 49er) but practice/experience really is the way forward...
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RS800 GBR848
Weston SC |
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combat wombat ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 345 |
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The absolute key to sailing skiffs is agility and ability to move
quickly. As crew, you have to keep the boat completely,
absolutely flat at all times. Otherwise, the rudder will stall
and you will get wet.
My advice would be to sail about without the kite at first, get used to keeping it flat and steering from the wire. Move fast into tacks and keep the boat flat throughout. If you find a relatively experienced crew, they can remedy a lot of mistakes that you might make when learning. Then, stick the kite up and have a go in light winds. Remember, with the kite, if it powers up and heels over, steer further downwind which will keep the boat flat. If you lose power, head up to "hot it up" as they say and increase power. Gybing the 29er is quite hard as they can easily lose a lot of speed in gybes, but try to keep the speed on, don't use too much rudder to steer it, and once committed, don't lose your nerve and bail out, or you will swim. The helm must move fast in gybes and be on the new windward side of the boat when the main fills (the crew will be taking care of the spinnaker sheets). Don't steer too far up out of a gybe or you will swim, instead try to steer back downwind a bit after the mainsail gybes (but again not too far or you will gybe back and swim). Hopefully the 29er sailors here can add any more tips, or point you to a website with tips. You've got a lot on your plate, but it isn't impossible as long as you think about what went wrong and try to work out how to avoid that the next time. Quite a lot of chat on 29ers on www.sailinganarchy.com, look here: http://www.sailinganarchy.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=4 2453&hl=29er (probably not for the faint-hearted btw). |
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B14 GBR 772
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k_kirk ![]() Posting king ![]() Joined: 09 May 06 Location: Japan Online Status: Offline Posts: 172 |
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CurlyBen, I agree. My wife calls it my mid-life crisis toy. I call it a new chance to get back in shape and enjoy some great sailing with my kids. Why XX and not the regular... Singapore has low winds for the most part of the year. I will be on the 140kg range with my crew so I think this is a better long term investment assuming I eventually master the art! Thanks for your suggestion. First order is get fit & agile. Thats clear. Unfortunately where I live (Singapore) there is no course. As far as I know this will be only the second 29er here and the first with an XX rig. So my chances are occasional outings with the other 29er sailor (who is kind enough already to offer a day out when we can match our schedules) and mainly self teach. I will go and order the DVD right away. Sounds like a good option to at least see how its done first.
Combat Wombat, great insight & thoughts. Thank you very much for the time you took to write. SAiling without the kite is a good suggestion I guess. Its to ofar ahead for me to figure out how to sail with one... I will try your suggestions. PS. The link to SA seems to be broken. Can you recall the subject line of that thread? Thanks once again for your kind help. Cheers |
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combat wombat ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Jan 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 345 |
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subject line was "sailing the 29er" I believe. Wade through the inital abuse and theres some good tips there.
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B14 GBR 772
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Just take everything right down to the very stupid basics of sailing but just react quicker than you normally do. Like, if the boat heels ease the main, if it comes on top then pull in the main, i mean that basic. Simple stupid things like that! You'll pick up technique and good handling through practice. But as long as you take everything down to the very basics you should survive pretty well.
Doug ps. the more basic i went with the 600, the easier it became to sail. Edited by Doug.H |
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CurlyBen ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 17 Aug 05 Location: Southampton Online Status: Offline Posts: 539 |
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Another point to bear in mind is that when gybing you control when the boom comes across - if you just steer until it moves you will swim! It's a big fully battened main and when those battens crack the power comes on quickly. You want to be bringing the boom across by hand pretty much dead downwind. I have to admit I'd advise getting the kite out straight away, 2 sail reaching is often the sketchiest part of sailing a skiff and the boat handles very differently without it. If the wind's light it's probably a good idea to sail it like a conventional 29er, i.e. short tiller extension, crew on the wire at first. I'd done a lot of sailing before trying to helm on the wire and still found it an interesting experience! Lots of small tiller movements are the way forward, jerk it around and you'll swim. Don't expect it to be like sailing a Laser etc. the style of sailing is completely different! Going upwind you play the main much more in the 9ers than on other boats, as the crew is doing it. Don't pinch going upwind, it doesn't suit the boats, but is a good way of dumping power if you're going to swim if you don't! Going downwind the main and jib trim is left pretty much constant, and much tighter than in a Laser or similar - the end of the boom will still be inside the boat, and the boat is steered downwind - this is where the small movements come in! Make sure you get enough kicker on going upwind, but if you don't ease it coming back down you won't be able to bear off easily in gusts - you do need to keep some on though, generally more as it gets windier. There's lots of other things which you'll probably figure out as you go along, but most importantly don't get disheartened when you swim, it's not easy and there's a lot to think about!
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RS800 GBR848
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Prince Buster ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 15 Dec 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1146 |
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k_kirk, i approve of your choice.
big respect to you, it will be an awesome challenge for sure! Firstly, I'd advise a lot of fitness work as this is essential for skiff sailing - agility, stamina, strength, body composition, and balance work are all important. The next thing is just plain time on the water, light conditions first, find yourself a very good crew who's not going to make mistakes and try to get a feel for the boat. Maybe get some DVDs or lessons on skiff sailing and you should have great fun after you get over the initial learning curve. |
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international moth - "what what?"
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Jack Sparrow ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 08 Feb 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2965 |
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Getting rid of the weight would help a lot. When you have done that you will find everything a lot easier. Fitness in skiffs is a big part of it, and the fitter you are the less mistakes you make, and the more time you seem to have so you don't make the mistakes. It's a catch 22. So the thing I'd do is go running 3 times a week, just make sure you run for more than 20 mins ( pref 40 ), as you need to get into oxygen debt for it to do the job. Speed when running isn't important until you are fit. Nice and slow but don't stop, and build the speed. After a month of that I would almost guarantee you will be better at sailing your boat. Then training and honing your boat handling will start to make a difference. |
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m_liddell ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 27 May 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 583 |
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Truth. When I was just getting into hp boats I kept stuffing gybes until someone told me this! I second getting higher and faster DVD, it's exactly what you need. Learning to helm a skiff type boat is a lot easier if you are not having to worry about trapezing too, try lighter winds staying off the wire at first with only the crew out. If you can get a good crew it will help lots, they will be able to compensate for your mistakes or at least anticipate them. Also the crew can take the main upwind in the 29er making your job much easier. In boats like this you need to sail it largely on reflex which comes from knowing how the boat reacts and internalising all the theory. If you have to think even for a fraction of a second before you bear away when a gust hits downwind you will swim. If you can get someone as a chase boat who know what they are doing that will really help since they can coach you and see where you are going wrong. Stick with it, the harder it is the more rewarding it is when you get it right! |
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