PY numbers?

Speedy,

You are opening a whole can of worms here...

PY is an average of all clubs that submitted returns for all boars over a range of coniditons. It gives and average relative speed of boats. As we all know there are some boats that have a noticable advantage in light winds (COmet, British Moth) and some that have an advantage when the wind gets up (Cherub, Fireball).

The PY is the average speed of the average sailor in average winds (as long as an even spread of returns has been submitted). There are some boats (noticably Phantoms at my club) that just do not go out when the wind is over a F4-5, this can skew the returns if enough sailors do the same.

What you seem to be getting at is an idea of personal handicaps which seem to work great for a lot of clubs that use them but are very admin intensive.

There used to be a couple of guys from the RYA PY panel that lurked here, one of them may see this and respond.

I will point out this is my understanding of how the system works and it could be wrong...

Paul

I'd strongly suggest to anyone considering the use of light/heavy airs PN variations: don't!!

Ask yourself what the next stage is. People wanting a PN variation for light/heavy crew? Flat water/waves? Different courses? For example, If all the racing in the UK was done over windward/leeward courses a lot of PN's that are very well-established would probably change significantly. Does that mean clubs should vary PN's when sailing W/L? Dangerous path to go down if you ask me. I'd have thought handicap racing was the less serious side of dinghy racing, so as long as you have a number that gets close to reflecting your boat's performance most of the time, I'd leave well alone!

Neil

Originally posted by NeilP I'd strongly suggest to anyone considering the use of light/heavy airs PN variations: don't!! Ask yourself what the next stage is. People wanting a PN variation for light/heavy crew? Flat water/waves? Different courses? For example, If all the racing in the UK was done over windward/leeward courses a lot of PN's that are very well-established would probably change significantly. Does that mean clubs should vary PN's when sailing W/L? Dangerous path to go down if you ask me. I'd have thought handicap racing was the less serious side of dinghy racing, so as long as you have a number that gets close to reflecting your boat's performance most of the time, I'd leave well alone! Neil

I agree. Unless you are willing to change every class PY that asks for it then it's just a good way of dividing your membership. You can only really adjust it if you have a big fleet with mixed ability. You don't really want change the handicap on a small fleet as they might all be very good and that esentially becomes a personal handicap for those sailors but applied to a whole fleet, inhibiting class growth.

As a sailor of a class who's handicap varies dramatically above and below trapezing conditions (F3ish) I just take the long view in that these things even out over a series. Of course short series and one-off events are a bit of a lottery but that's life.

Our lake is quite long and aligned along(ish) the prevailing wind so we often get either a long beat (hurrah!) and several deep reaches (boo!) or several short beats (Hmm) and some deep reaches (Booo!) followed by a really long run (BOOOO!!!).

Of course if it's blowing old boots it's Hurrah! all round as I just plane all the way round the course!

Don't think even the smartest, fairest RO could cope with a fair handicap for those conditions.

Originally posted by jeffers Luckily Hunts lake is pretty much a square.

A square ?

I thought it was more round than square

We have some pretty shifty conditions at grafham and it's quite a bit larger!

(p.s are you doing the Gran Prix this year?)

Edited by les5269