Fastest dinghy?

Hi Chris,

Not every cat sailor feels this way.....  I grew up in monos and have spent more years sailing them than cats.  Whilst I love the Tornado, I still love jumping back onto monos such as lasers, MGs and skiffs.

The fact is that monos do give multies a run.  An MG will give a Mari a good run.  A smaller skiff will give a taipan a good run and an 18 will give an F18 and Tornado a good run.

I have raced many boats from Lasers, 125s, 12, 15, 16 18 skiffs to Mari Cats and Tornadoes.......  Not to mention Keel Boats.

I had a ball on all these boats and even the slowest of these can be a blast in fresh conditions.  I think it is important to get out and try as many different classes as possible.  Not only do I feel it improves your sailing and awareness of other boats, but you will enjoy your sailing allot more.  After all we all sail for the enjoyment off it.  Even the most profesional sailor.

My weopen of choice was a Tornado, until I sold it 2 weeks ago and may well be the next boat I buy.  But it could quiet easily be a skiff or smaller mono.  Or may be a mono and a cat.

Re "Whilst the 18 foot skiffs are going faster these days, the Tornado is going MUCH faster."

That's great - BUT CAN SOMEONE TELL THE TORNADO SAILORS TO AGITATE FOR A NEW YARDSTICK!

They keep on saying "we're going soooo much faster" and then they keep sailing on a yardstick that's just 4.5% faster than the old rig. Can we get it worked out one way or the other? Either they are so much faster (in which case the yardstick should be changed) or they are not.

It's not just Tornadoes that are doing this. The F16 guys do the same thing. As do the Moths. They keep on telling us Canoe sailors how fast they are, then they get a 15% lower yardstick.

(Yeah, I know the Tornado association doesn't set the yardstick and B & F don't worry about yardstick racing. It just seems that the kite cats are getting it both ways at the moment. Don't they feel embarrassed, I mean by their own terms they are getting an unfair advantage?).

Sure, but was it ever implied that it was B & F that were being spoken about as the T sailors? Of course not, you don't call world champs "national champs" (2) the reference was always about giving the T a run for its money ON YARDSTICK  (3) Sure, B & F kill that Tornado; the top Taipan will kill the Taipan I was using as comparison, as well.

Re "The San Fran Bridge to Bridge would be a good race between a sailboard, an 18 foot skiff and a Tornado - but only because it is one way. If it was there and back, the cat would win by half an hour or more."

Sure, no problems - but upwind and downwind racing was not the point of the original post. Dash speed was.

Interestingly, Forbesey has said that the 18 would be killed downwind, now he says that the B to B would be "a good race". Which is true - would the 18 be killed or would it be a good race? I'm not pretending I know, but there are mixed messages here.

"It was just a shame (an ignorant shame though) that the initial question asked was "what is the best/fastest dinghy that I should buy?". Hopefully some education to the person who asked the question may sway them into buy a "fun" boat (a catamaran)."

Forbesy has said similar things in letters to the editor, and it gets plenty of people feeling very anti-cat.

Firstly, he thinks that anyone who does not share his taste in boats is ignorant. Secondly, he assumes that any education will turn people to cats. Thirdly, he assumes that cats are "fun" boats and by implication, other boats are not.

OK, I'll look at people I know. I know a guy who has designed cats, who lived aboard one, who has built 58' of cats, and was a top 5 ranked Tornado sailor nationally with a very old boat. Yet he doesn't like racing small cats. For several reasons, it does not do it for him.

I know another guy who grew up sailing cats, finished (IIRC) 2nd in the Tornado nationals (perhaps behind Forbes and and Booth when they were sailing together) and now sails skiffs. Is he "ignorant" of cats? Is he "uneducated" about cats? Does he sail skiffs because they are not fun? Not likely!

I know another sailor (let's call him C.N. ) who finished 3rd (or 4th) in that same nats. 4th (or 3rd) was a world champ and Olympic medallist in Ts. Yet C.N. prefers to sail 505s and skiffs. Yes, he has tried cats. Yes, he did very well in a short campaign. So he is not ignorant or uneducated. Yet he prefers 505s (most of all).

Ok, so cats are faster than dinghies. Who cares? Not everyone. Sailboards have higher top speeds than cats as well, but that doesn't mean that cat sailors are ignorant or uneducated (although surprisingly few cat sailors I know have tried boards, and with two exceptions none of those who have are any good).

Sorry for going off, this sort of stuff really gets me.

I asked John Forbes to comment on this thread via e-mail and recieved the following reply (in full as John requests)

Tornadoes are capable off in excess of 33 knots in the right contitions.

1997 Bermuda World Tornado Championship, during an event called the Bacardi Blast sprint. A timed run between gates that were 500 feet apart.

The Record stands at 27 MPH or 23.5 knots average over the 500 foot course. Completed in 12.53 seconds.

You acn find some footage here on John Forbes web site http://www.acay.com.au/~gonzo/tornado.mpeg

This was the days of the old rig with no spinnaker.