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Rupert View Drop Down
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    Posted: 01 Jul 16 at 2:19pm
Instead of stressing about minor tweaks that might be made, laser sailors will be stressing about minor technique changes to offset the bits that are wrong, so just a different set of obsessions.

I can see why the mainsheet catching thing isn't changed now, but why didn't they on the prototype? Same with the rudder.
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Posts: 823 		Post Options Post Options   Quote PeterG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 16 at 1:58pm
You miss the point, Chris. What the thousands who sail Lasers think is irrelevant. The only test of whether something is being done correctly or not is what GRF thinks.
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 16 at 1:50pm
Originally posted by iGRF

Originally posted by Chris 249



So the world's biggest class is doing it wrong?


Yes and yes it is doing it wrong, why do you even ask?

Because there is no logically valid evidence that it is doing it wrongly.  If it was doing it wrongly, it wouldn't be the biggest (or second biggest) class in the world.

And no, personal opinions are not evidence. And nor is concentrating on what is happening in one extremely unusual, although very interesting, market.
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 16 at 1:42pm
Originally posted by JimC

Originally posted by SimonW99

just dont see why you wouldnt something so minor

I think there are people for whom the inability to change anything in class rules is a positive advantage. It means you can just turn up each Sunday, confident the boat is just right, and if something needs fixing you just order up the standard item. It makes for a simple life. Wouldn't suit me, but vive la difference and all that.

Yep. And not only that, some of us prefer the strict SMOD mindset not only because we like being on equal kit, but because we like not having to think about the defects in the boat that we should be fixing.

In a development class you look at things with a critical eye to see what has to be improved. To be always looking for defects and always noting what's wrong can be very frustrating in some ways, although it's also fascinating and rewarding.  Yep, so I know my light-wind development-class sail is outmoded...... great, I either get to spend $3000 or I get to look at it and know that comparatively speaking, it's crap. 

There can be something zen-like about a strict SMOD. Yes, things could perhaps be better but the point is that you get to accept them and ignore them, instead of worrying about them and trying to work out how to fix them.  Sure, the balance in my SMODs is imperfect, but if we're out sailing then we are already incredibly lucky - why stress about the tiny details? 

Of course, the development-class mindset is equally good, it's just that as you say, neither is superior.


Edited by Chris 249 - 01 Jul 16 at 1:47pm
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 16 at 1:34pm
Originally posted by Chris 249



So the world's biggest class is doing it wrong?


Yes and yes it is doing it wrong, why do you even ask?
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Chris 249 View Drop Down
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Posts: 2041 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris 249 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jul 16 at 1:30pm
Originally posted by getafix

I think anyone who expounds on the virtues of resisting change in OD or SMODs at all cost only has to look at the L*ser rudder as a prime example of why, when change is needed, the class needs to be strong enough (and have the capability through a majority vote of CA members) to bring change through. 

The Blaze is, IMO, a good example of this.

Of course, tight control over change is preferred by most class members (even in dev classes in my experience) but at least a willingness to debate changes with members and listen to opinion rather than just shout it down (almost just for the sake of shouting it down) are positive and promote a feeling of inclusion.

So the world's biggest class is doing it wrong?

I do understand the desire to change the Laser rudder. Personally I'd just allow everyone to move the pivot hole. But from an objective point of view, surely the Laser's success indicates that it can hardly be used as an object lesson in how not to do it.
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jun 16 at 9:09am
Quite a bit of buzz about the D-Zero class at the moment. We had out Nationals last weekend and there are a few of us off to the Birkettt this coming weekend.

VR Sport did a great job of filming days 2 and 3 and Highcliffe an amazing job of organising and running the event.

They also provided us with a photo gallery which has been put on the class site, why not surf on over as quick as a D-Zero in waves and take a look.... http://www.d-zerosailing.org

(end blatant class plug)
Paul
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ventus View Drop Down
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Posts: 43 		Post Options Post Options   Quote ventus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Mar 16 at 1:04pm
I seem to remember when I started sailing over 25 years ago, the laser class did vote on a proposal for a larger rudder and it was defeated by a large margin. Nothing was ever heard about it again, which is a great shame.
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Posts: 2143 		Post Options Post Options   Quote getafix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Mar 16 at 12:01pm
I think anyone who expounds on the virtues of resisting change in OD or SMODs at all cost only has to look at the L*ser rudder as a prime example of why, when change is needed, the class needs to be strong enough (and have the capability through a majority vote of CA members) to bring change through. 

The Blaze is, IMO, a good example of this.

Of course, tight control over change is preferred by most class members (even in dev classes in my experience) but at least a willingness to debate changes with members and listen to opinion rather than just shout it down (almost just for the sake of shouting it down) are positive and promote a feeling of inclusion.
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Mar 16 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by SimonW99

I think what he is saying is that an early fresh water washed boat will race at the same weight as a new one. The new epoxy would, one would hope, be a bit stiffer. I am sure Mr Blaze will be along shortly to reinforce this, but I believe that early boats and indeed quite a few Blaze X's with either mast and new sails remain very competitive. I recall that polyester boats that have been sea sailed for some time need to be fresh water washed (presumably all the insides) and then dried out otherwise they can weigh heavier. Will be interesting to see if if Hartleys take weight out like they did the Supernova.They could always correct back with correctors in the right place and the boat would be better. 

Sorry massive igrf thread drift Now back to the Dzero and its Enterprise sail....

I seem to recall that the only reason Hartley took weight out was because they own the right to the Supernova. As far as i am aware the transfer of the Blaze does not include the rights which are (were) still owned by a 3rd party. I am sure Cirrus will confirm or correct this.
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