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Dinghy hull weights

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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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    Posted: 26 Aug 16 at 12:51pm
Originally posted by Roger

Somebody suggested earlier in the thread that a boat may have taken up 20kg of water, really? that would be aprox 20 litres, is that realistic in a 4-5m long dinghy............

My thoughts exactly, a couple of litres maybe but not 20......
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 16 at 2:28pm
Possible perhaps given a large quantity of not-very-closed-cell-foam reserve buoyancy.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 16 at 3:55pm
Originally posted by JimC

Possible perhaps given a large quantity of not-very-closed-cell-foam reserve buoyancy.


I have seen worse than 20 kg on a dory hull not much bigger than a 505.
Lots of foam, lots of plywood.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 16 at 12:35pm

Still leaves a couple of questions though. I know the minimum weight is 72kgs but what is standard weight? and are the modern ones made to the same weight tolerance as thew 10yr old ones or are the built closer to 72kgs now?

Apologies for late response ... 'standard' and minimum weight for the Blaze are the same thing – and it is 72kg.  It includes full wing system, centreboard, all fittings and lines but excludes rig and rudder assembly.  After the switch to epoxy many years ago it became easy enough to build all boats a few kg below 72kg.  They were/are all weighed after fit-out and correctors are then added - so all are on the nail at 72kg.   This means that IF a hull has a major smash the hull can be easily repaired and if more ‘structure’ is involved in any repair the additional weight can be offset by adjustment to the correctors (btw these are generally ‘bonded’ into the hull so it becomes more difficult to ‘forget’ them on a day to day basis - if you get my drift  LOL ).   The ‘spread’ of weights amongst the polyester boats has probably widened over the years for the reasons already discussed but the best are still v.close to 72kg and remain highly competitive against the later boats.  We weighed all entrants boats at one National Championships ( a right pain for all concerned of course but there was no wind that day!) and all epoxy boats were very very close together at 72kg.  Polyester ones had a much wider spread which we suspect was as much to do with moisture uptake over the intervening years as it was the original build tolerances.  Would ‘we’ build any new boat in polyester today ourselves – No.   Vinyl-ester and/or epoxy are worth the price differential imo.

Could we have reduced the class minimum weight ?  - Very probably but this would have made the early polyester boats at a disadvantage and produced in effect a ‘two-class’ boat.   Usefully at this weight  the Blazes is not particularly fragile (though some owners do try to prove otherwise and drive them extremely hard in just about any conditions – the boats are simply superb fun in F4+) …. but if owners do have a problem the hull can still be easily enough sorted.



Edited by Cirrus - 30 Aug 16 at 12:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote transient Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 16 at 4:03pm
Ta for that reply, very interesting.

Talking of two class boats due to weight variations, how are RS doing with the 2000? I know the early Laser ones were lighter than the later Laser ones by a large margin (10kgs that I've witnessed and 20 kgs that I've heard about.) I'm wondering how the new ones compare. 

Edited by transient - 30 Aug 16 at 4:05pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 16 at 6:23pm
On the subject of lightweight single handers has anybody sailed a Europe? There's one for sale here, I still have a soft spot for my old OK but I don't think I fancy sailing one in a breeze these days (and I'm not sure I could get under the boom anymore). The Europe looks as if it might suit me (low boom lowing but it doesn't look as low as an OK), light at 45 kgs, 7m sail, supposed to be a decent sea boat and it looks reasonably comfortable (for a hiker) to sail. I'm at the top of the weight range at 75kg (which sounds about right) and the PY might give me a chance against them pesky kids in the Radials.....

Edited by Sam.Spoons - 30 Aug 16 at 7:05pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 16 at 6:37pm
I liked Europes when I had a ride in a couple decades ago. I wouldn't fit in one now, but I'm currently using a Vintage Moth which is one generation newer (much the same beam, less rocker, more modern rig and thus headroom) and enjoying pottering about in it.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 16 at 9:54pm
I think I may not be bendy enough for a Europe so I'm reconsidering the Blaze as a possible but would like to buy an epoxy hull. Cirrus? Do you know what sail number the manufacture changed to epoxy?

Edited by Sam.Spoons - 08 Sep 16 at 10:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Sep 16 at 9:13am
The switch to epoxy happened a few years back and the first one was number '747'.   Hartleys have now taken on the Blaze and to kick things off made an attractive introductory offer - this produced 20 paid up deposits, with more promised and in the pipeline, many coming  from existing owners looking to renew their boats. 

This is incredibly good news if you are currently looking for a decent used epoxy boat. The market for good (epoxy) Blazes has always been very tight (aka premium priced) but with a number of the deposits being coming from owners of epoxy boats you should have some real choice - and a bit of negotiating power comes with that choice !   The new Hartley ones will come on stream before too long and now we are approaching the end of the season some owners will be very keen to sell their current boats in advance of taking delivery.  

Many go by word of mouth but you could try a 'wanted' ad on the class association website - and if you go this route you should be able to reach a good deal..
 






Edited by Cirrus - 09 Sep 16 at 10:10am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ifoxwell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Sep 16 at 10:12am
I sail a Blaze at the same weight as and would say that the mk3's are better than the mk2's but not by very much, far more important is the carbon mast which makes a big difference at our weight. I recently went back to a mk2 715, but upgraded it with a second hand carbon mast from Mike and its a great boat. I weighed it last winter during a refit and it is pretty much down to weight (73.5kg) and goes just as quick as 807, which itself was a great boat. Of course carbon masts tend to only be available on the second hand market with mk3's so I may not have added that much to your decision process.
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