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Feva or Laser?

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mike ellis View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mike ellis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Feva or Laser?
    Posted: 31 Dec 06 at 4:13pm
Originally posted by Riki @ RS

The Feva doesn't hold rig tension, its essentially an unstayed rig and the shrouds stop the rig from pulling forwards when the kite is up. The jib haliard just needs to be tight enough to stop the luff from sagging.

disagree, you need the jib luff tight to stop it flogging and it helps pointing but the easiest way to do this is to make a loop in the halyard and put it back through itself making a 3:1.

Its all rather clever when you look at the nitty gritty and what it has to do.

possibly

The mainsheet is one to one as standard, but many sailors, especially youth sailors, add an additional block on the mainsheet horse to create a 2:1.

nononononono you dont need a 2:1 its a waste of string. me and my sister did fine with a 1:1 you do need the bigger kiker though, even 6:1 its not quite big enough when it gets windy.

The Feva rudder is huge for the size of boat, but gives a really reassuring solid feel, but is quite punishing if the boat is not flat or the blade is not fully rotated down. The depth of the blade means that slight changes in feel are very nticeable on the tiller, but means that the blade maintains grip to quite high levels of heel without stalling.

agreed. the rudder is fine if its locked down properly and doesnt load up untill you get well heeled over or if you stick the bow in downwind without the kite, if you do this the rudder load can push 11 stone out of its toestraps and over the side of the boat. but otherwise its nice and light.

is that useful riki?



Edited by mike ellis
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radial179102 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote radial179102 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 06 at 2:09pm
Yes but the method of cleating the Feva's Halyard is awful!! I'm sorry but whenever Feva's sail at our club, they have to roll them over on the beach just to check that the halyard is in the cleat and their main wont fall down half way around the course!!!

As for the Jib, it needs that tension when it gets windy, and where I sail, it inevitably does!! When the kids sailing the Feva feather it to help upwind in the gusts, they head up a little, and the front of the jib backwinds, causing the whole rig to flap around madly!!! Which is very disconcerting for the kids.

A lot of the kids that sail Feva's can't believe how much better the RS visions and 200's are and always ask, "why can't we have that on our Feva?!"



Admittely I like the kite system, and the XLmainsail is nice when you have the race kit on the rest of the boat!


Edited by radial179102


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Post Options Post Options   Quote Riki @ RS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 06 at 10:11am

The Feva doesn't hold rig tension, its essentially an unstayed rig and the shrouds stop the rig from pulling forwards when the kite is up. The jib haliard just needs to be tight enough to stop the luff from sagging. Thats why its just a one to one purchase and the rope is pre stretch - it stops the rig from being over tensioned. The mast doesn't have spreaders (for versitility - big sail, little sail, single/double handed, etc, storage of mast in the boat) so pulling rig tension will just make the mast floppy in the middle section. This is also the reason the main haliard cleat is at the top of the mast - otherwise there is a 'bow and arrow' type effect when the haliard is taut and cleated at the bottom and the mast is floppy in the middle. We've recently sourced a side load camcleat for the top of the mast which is even easier than the old front load cleat. Theres actually not many examples of unstayed, unspreadered masts that have a haliard at the bottom (I can only think of old Solos) the Europe, RS300, Vareo, Finn, most Catamarans etc. all have their haliard fixed at the top of the mast.

Polyethylene hulls are proportionately softer than fibreglass hulls that can have local reinforcement, so any PE boat that holds rig tension requires the mast to be locked low down with a foot strut and lowers (a la Vago, Magno, Omega) or via a hanging mast foot and a high foredeck (a la Vision). This triangulates the rig loads. The Feva doesn't have these, so the extreme loads on the rig are soaked up by its softness, and the shrouds stop the mast from over bending when the spinnaker is up. Its all rather clever when you look at the nitty gritty and what it has to do.

The mainsheet is one to one as standard, but many sailors, especially youth sailors, add an additional block on the mainsheet horse to create a 2:1. The standard mainsheet rope length is long enough to do this. Both the mainsheet and kicker are upgraded as part of an inexpensive 'race pack', which makes life easier for those who are going to be using them, whilst not bumping the price of the boat up for those who don't know/care about adjusting! I guess your experience with fevas is on the Bough Beech club boats - these were supplied in basic spec - perhaps you should propose to the relevant committee that they are upgraded. The Sevenoaks School boats at BBSC have a modified mainsheet system for team racing - they obviously need a one to one.

The Feva rudder is huge for the size of boat, but gives a really reassuring solid feel, but is quite punishing if the boat is not flat or the blade is not fully rotated down. The depth of the blade means that slight changes in feel are very nticeable on the tiller, but means that the blade maintains grip to quite high levels of heel without stalling. Again, this is a versitility concern - enough control for the racers, enough reassurance for the novices. Sailed flat and fast and with the blade properly locked down, you should find the blade finger tip light. Check the boats you're sailing are rigged correctly, theres two rotating holes in the head of the blade depending on the make of rudder stock (there have been a couple of different models), and if you use the wrong one it will over/under rotate. The manual will help.

Hope this helps explain. You won't believe how much thought and attention went into designing parts of the boat might have been considered 'cutting corners', though inevitably there are slight compromises to suit the boat to a large number of people. Nevertheless it is this large number of users which creates the Fevas international popularity, good racing curcuit, squad training, etc. too.

I wasn't having a dig last night (albeit tongue in cheek ) RS genuinely wants to talk with people who have strong views on aspects of our boats. We are sailors and racers and instructors too, and our sport is driven by the enthusiasm, be it positive or otherwise, of its participants.

Riki Hooker
Sales Director, RS Sailing
www.rssailing.com
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BBSCFaithfull View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote BBSCFaithfull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 06 at 2:12am
Well,
I dont really want to waste my time talking about a feva if i did go so lets talk about it here!
The jib halyard is the worst piece of kit in the world you can never get enough tension on the damn thing. The mainsheet purchase is crap the youth's find it hard to play the main properly and the kicker hasn't enough purchase on it.
I also dont like the main cleat at the top of the mast and the rudder loads are quite high.
That's about all i can think of for the mo
Alex


Edited by BBSCFaithfull
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radial179102 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote radial179102 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec 06 at 12:03am
I agree!! But I would choose a Laser over a Feva any day.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rob.e Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 06 at 6:40pm

How about if I stir it up a bit and say that the Laser is the most horrible boat ever made IMHO? Hard work for little reward, and horribly uncomfy, I gave up sailing for two years after I had one! (Mind you, I was too light and it was before the small rigs, new controls etc, and the build quality of some of the bits was pretty suspect back in the 70's!)

Stands back and waits for reaction.....

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Post Options Post Options   Quote FireballNeil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 06 at 6:16pm
THE FEVA IS RUBBISH! No only joking I expect tha they are loike the rest of teh RS boats which look pretty well made to me! Just thought i would cause a bit more of  a stir-up! heheh 
Neil

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Contender443 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 06 at 6:12pm
Originally posted by Riki @ RS

Originally posted by BBSCFaithfull

Originally posted by Dart_Fart

 The great crusade against the Feva has begun !!! 


They are actually quite shockingly rigged. RS cut so many corners when building it!

The multi award winning RS design team would be delighted to hear your detailed report of areas that you feel could be improved. Please PM or email me a list and we can dicuss them off forum and then report back to everyone on the progress we've made. As you were 'shocked' by the rigging experience I've no doubt there'll be plenty for us to get our teeth into. Perhaps I could send you a ticket to the boat show and we could talk over the Feva on the stand.

In the meantime, best of luck with your driving test, I read elsewhere that this is imminent?

So if I complain about the Feva as well, will I get a free ticket to the boat show??

Shame I have never had any experience of one.

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mike ellis View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote mike ellis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 06 at 6:03pm
now now children, calm down.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote radial179102 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Dec 06 at 5:33pm
oooh this topic just got interesting!!!


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