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What constitutes a mark rounding?
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Scooby_simon View Drop Down
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    Posted: 29 Mar 06 at 12:26pm
Originally posted by Stefan Lloyd

Originally posted by Scooby_simon

I think you could argue that using the "string" concept, that the boat had not completed the course.

AFAIK the RRS does not define what consitutes the "boat" in this context.

What about a keelboat that rounds the windward mark heeling so that the upper mast section on the "wrong" side of a vertical line through the mark. That is a perfectly feasible situation. Nobody would say they had not rounded the mark properly. 

 

If the mast is in the water, they have more to worry about than the course.!

My point is that I'd be inclined to protest if someone flew a flew a hull over a mark, but the plate was still in the mater, however if the plate was also out i'd give them a

If a keel boat (or any other boat wants to round a mark with the mast over the top of it, I'm not worried.

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Matt Jackson View Drop Down
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Posts: 962 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 06 at 12:59pm
Originally posted by far canal

is a tris windward float "normally" in the water ?????

 

not unless the designer made an *rse of it !

Well obviously. Different case to a cat... do try to keep up

For the record I don't think this has any practical application, I'm just interested. If you were racing against a Tri and they put a float the 'wrong' side of the mark would anyone happily let them on their way?



Edited by Matt Jackson
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far canal View Drop Down
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Posts: 110 		Post Options Post Options   Quote far canal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 06 at 1:18pm

not really , cats are meant to sail at optimum with windward hull  "Normally " "just " out the water .

When doing wild thing offwind sometimes it pays to lift win ward hull pretty high and with no board down either . got a rudder though !

Scoobys scenario - if plate was in the water  -      but other side of mark (pretty small one ) I would agree , not rounding , but going over !

As for letting anyone do it otherwise , I have no problems , i doubt there is anything in the rules to stop them anyway , adds colour to the occaison and good photo ops .

 

 

 

Better to concentrate on race rather than antics



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JimC View Drop Down
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If you really want a complicated situation imagine a cat that misjudges the run up to the mark and lifts the windward hull to clear the mark, and the rig then hits an outside/leeward boat. The helm of inside dumps the main and the windward hull hits the mark.

Its agreed by both parties that if the cat had approached the mark with both hulls in the water and far enough out not to hit the mark then outside had left enough room for inside to get round the mark.

Who does how many circles and why?

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Matt Jackson View Drop Down
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Posts: 962 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 06 at 4:57pm
Originally posted by far canal

not really , cats are meant to sail at optimum with windward hull  "Normally " "just " out the water .

When doing wild thing offwind sometimes it pays to lift win ward hull pretty high and with no board down either . got a rudder though !

Scoobys scenario - if plate was in the water  -      but other side of mark (pretty small one ) I would agree , not rounding , but going over !

As for letting anyone do it otherwise , I have no problems , i doubt there is anything in the rules to stop them anyway , adds colour to the occaison and good photo ops .

 

 

 

Better to concentrate on race rather than antics

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catmandoo View Drop Down
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Posts: 545 		Post Options Post Options   Quote catmandoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 12 at 1:47pm

ISAF Racing Rules Question and Answer Service

D 003 Q&A 2009-014

Published: 09 January 2009

Question

A catamaran on port tack approaches a leeward mark to be left to port. Does a catamaran that

"flies" its port (windward) hull over, and possibly to windward of, a leeward mark comply with the

requirements of rule 28.1 in relation to that mark rounding? The starboard hull is the only hull in

the water (creating a track) and this hull passes the mark correctly.

Answer

Yes.
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Andymac View Drop Down
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Posts: 852 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Andymac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 12 at 7:11pm
Blimey, 6 1/2 years for a definitive answer!
Well done for the update Catmandoo.
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gordon View Drop Down
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Posts: 1037 		Post Options Post Options   Quote gordon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Aug 12 at 10:14pm
However.... consider rule 44.2... when a boat takes a penalty at or near the finishing line, she shall sail completely to the course side of the line before finishing. In this particular instance you cannot fly a hull, or any part of the hull, equipment or crew over the mark!
Gordon
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catmandoo View Drop Down
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Posts: 545 		Post Options Post Options   Quote catmandoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 12 at 9:52am
Ah but thats a completely different scenario and not in question , however i would take from the above isaf clarification , that once you  had satisfied the requirement of " completly returned to the course side of the finish line " 
you could.   
THEN finish correctly if your subsequent finishing involved flying a hull over the mark ,
 in fact does it even matter how you return "completely"to the course side of the line , as wether you flew a hull over the line on the way back is immaterial as once "completely" on course side of the line , Just dont spin round ends on one hull 


So get "completely " course side.   Then  approach again flying a hull as high as you can , after all its what us cats like best  Wink


Raises question , does hitting the ro with your board constitute hitting a mark ,or bad etiquette


Edited by catmandoo - 30 Aug 12 at 9:58am
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 12 at 10:36am
Originally posted by catmandoo

does hitting the ro with your board constitute hitting a mark

That's easy: its a gross breach of good manners, hence RRS69 [grin]
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