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Should members pay to race?
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Noah View Drop Down
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Posts: 611 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Noah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Should members pay to race?
    Posted: 04 May 17 at 3:52pm
The difference there is that it those are team games. If you wanna play, you have to support the team or you wont't get picked next time. How would any committment be enforced? The only method I've seen is thru the minimum number of races to qualify. Even that is a bit weak because a hotshot who has to count a bunch of DNC's won't beat over a series Mr. Steady who turns out every week and finishes - wherever he finishes. However, when I - against all the sooth-sayers and doom-mongers advice - increased the qualification threshold from under 50% to over 50% participation actually increased.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 6:36pm
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

The incentive to race a series is there in the form of a minimum number of races to count and large points allocated to DNC results effectively taking you out of the places if you can't discard them. Which, incidentally means that those who can only race some of the series are racing for the fun of it on the day rather than with hopes of a result).
But this is the point, isn't it?  This incentive clearly doesn't work, people take each race day as a race in isolation, and the series is an irrelevance. I believe series races are poorly attended partly because they have become irrelevant - either they should be scrapped or improved somehow.  If there was a mixture whereby some series you could just rock up, but others you had to commit to (some how, not sure how if the nominal payment is so offensive to so many), I think the different series would grow different identities. 
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 7:13pm
If the payment was a means to reduce annual subs for those who can only sail at the club occasionally then it might be a goer, I can only sail Wednesday evenings during the season as I'm away my caravan most weekends and usually committed to something else otherwise. 

An additional series fee would mean I would not race the occasional Sunday I'm not away and would only sail the first and last series as I'd miss 5 weeks in the summer. Or I might not rejoin next year as it would be harder to justify a sub plus series fees for, maybe, 20 races. I can enter the winter series (which I can sail most of) for around 1/3rd of the annual sub and not need to join the club.

Mind you the club series at Leigh & Lowton are pretty well attended, 23 boats last Wednesday, similar at the weekends and 50+ for the open winter series' so they do ok.

BTW If you scrapped series' how would you justify an additional 'sailing fee' anyway?
Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 7:36pm
I think you are so keen to avoid paying anything, you have not read my post properly.
Btw 23 boats isn't that great for a weds evening is it?
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423zero View Drop Down
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 7:41pm
would be for my club, we haven't got that many boats in total.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 7:55pm
Yikes, how many duties a year do you do?
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turnturtle View Drop Down
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 8:37pm
I'd rather pay n play tbh.... I've no interest in paying for the races I can't attend through annual subs, if anything, annual subs just go to highlight how little a sailing club actually features and it's a saving I've decided I can afford to make.

For those Week in week out empty nesters, then fair enough, an annual pass suitably discounted, might well be better option.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 8:55pm
Originally posted by A2Z

I think you are so keen to avoid paying anything, you have not read my post properly.
Btw 23 boats isn't that great for a weds evening is it?

Quite the opposite, I'm happy to pay my subs (and do my two duties a year) so I can sail/race whenever I can. It would be much cheaper to just enter the winter series but I want to support my chosen club and sail when I can. However, there is a point when it becomes uneconomical and a 'per series' charge large enough to make me attend more frequently would certainly change my view on the value of my annual sub.

23 boats on a Wednesday evening seems pretty good to me these days.....
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423zero View Drop Down
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 9:22pm
A2Z, 2 minimum per year, I average about 12 OOD duties a year, about half of members can't set a course or run a race.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 17 at 10:31pm
That's a case for paying a part time RO. When I was Chairman of a windsurfing club we ran the racing from the water, we did gate starts (gate boat sets off from a given mark on port and we all started behind  him) and, with us all sailing RB 7.5 there was no PY required, first past the post was the winner and photo finishes were decided in the bar afterwards. Worked a treat and nobody had to do duties. We even used that method at regional open meetings occasionally when sailing from a waterspouts centre who could not provide an OOD. I realise that will not work at a busy/serious dinghy club (windsurfers are a bit more casual) but it would be possible to run pursuit racing from the shore without anybody giving up their days racing. Fastest boat runs the timed starts and then sets off last, beach starts will work as there are no start line tactics in force unless there are a number of one class, if that's so they start from leeward to windward according to the result of the previous race. 
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