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Club Starting procedures

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marke View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote marke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Club Starting procedures
    Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 2:49pm
Ian

At Starcross we have an automated lights system (5 starts - 3 minute intervals) - with additional flashing lights for shorten course, recalls and abandoning.  Linked to a PC based system for race entry, timing and race/series results generation system.  All housed in a shore based OOD's cabin, and all built locally.

When we have committee boat starts we use the standard flags system on the boat - but we synchronise the start of the sequence with the shore based PC system via VHF to allow the lap/finish timing to be done from the shore.  The downside of this is that the course needs to include a pass through of the club line for each lap - but at least the starts can be true(ish).

Next month I hope to start a rewrite of the PC based timing system which will be tablet friendly so may be suitable for use on the committee boat if we can find a suitable weatherproof tablet. I know other folks in the club have been thinking about a lights system for a committee boat (but as others have said this is a much harder problem than a shore based system.

Mark


Edited by marke - 04 Feb 14 at 2:50pm
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ianwat2212 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 1:25pm
Originally posted by sandgrounder


 
I understand that once the trial of the new system is complete the intention is to fully automate it.
 

Correct. The main reason for trialling a manual system first is that a fully automated system which will run reliably on a committee boat in the middle of a large, sometimes windy, lake will not be cheap. 
As it has turned out, the manual system has worked pretty well. As some have said, most people start their watch on zero (or the next hoot after they arrive at the start area) and then wait a safe distance away until 2 mins before their start. Everyone gets away with a minimum of waiting around and it's easy to explain to newcomers.

There seem to be a few people on here who's clubs run an automated system already, are they run from the shore or a committee boat?
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 11:55am
We still have people with watches, which most of the time is fine, though it is surprisingly easy to start chatting and miss the 1 minute!

Now we have a web cam, if we went automated, the race officer could just stay in bed and do it all on a laptop from home.
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 11:49am
Originally posted by tgruitt

Don't most clubs use an automated start box?

We'd need to upgrade our committee boat considerably for any kind of half sophisticated electronics to have much of a life on it I think. And we'd certainly much rather have the hassle of manual systems than a fixed point starts and finish box. Fine for river clubs or odd shaped lakes where you can't run open water courses anyway, but for middle sized open water clubs like ours the convenience of the electronics would compromise the racing too much. Once you have a large committee boat with the capability to run full electronics *and keep them operating* it becomes an option again of course. If money were no object I'd love to have a committee boat with a big digital clock on the side so club sailors wouldn't have to bother with watches.

Edited by JimC - 04 Feb 14 at 11:55am
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tgruitt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 10:49am
Originally posted by fab100

It appears Frensham leads the way again.

For decades we've had a programmed start box machine. Tell it how many races and time of first signal and off it goes, sounding horns and lighting lights with no further intervention. As boats cross the finish line, touch a button and it captures their time.

This used to be a custom made thing but a while back was migrated to a PC with the lights running off a serial interface.

Respect to Brian Cushing (RiP) for the original and Bob Castle and Roger Gilbert (yes, the Roger Gilbert) for the latter.

Works perfectly, no confusion possible and human error pretty much eliminated

It even does pursuit races at the click of a button too

Buckets?? I'm flabbergasted





Don't most clubs use an automated start box? We have pursuit and handicap race on a Sunday and it gives a hoot for each entered class in the pursuit (you can add extras) and finishes the race at the correct time. Then just a 5,4,1 countdown and hoot to start... simple!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote sandgrounder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 10:08am
I'd find it difficult to pass comment on a new starting system at my home club without trying it out at least once.
 
I used the new (trial) starting system at Grafham every Sunday during the month of January, and have to say that it's a massive improvement, well defined and clearly displayed.
 
Getting 5 disparate fleets away in 13 minutes is acceptable, in my opinion, with each fleet having a 5, 4, 1 countdown utilising both numerical and sound signals, and 2 minutes between the fleets.
 
I understand that once the trial of the new system is complete the intention is to fully automate it.
 


Edited by sandgrounder - 04 Feb 14 at 10:09am
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 9:51am
We run 4-2-go with starts at 2min intervals and the P staying up. 5-4-1-go seems impractical for club racing.
I liked the flag system they have at Loch Lomond which is each flag permanently attached to a pole and an array of sockets so flags are hoisted by placing stick in socket
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Dougal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 9:34am
I must admit I looked at it and thought it was a good and simple idea.  All you need to know is what minute you start on.  I know technically it is 5 4 1, but in practice if you are starting on 7 you start your watch on 0, hover near the line until the first start goes and then you have 2 mins to get yourself in position.  Assuming fleets aren't huge/lines too short then for a club race that is not an issue.  I take the point on fleet order, but that could easily be fixed.
What could possibly go wrong?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote alstorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 8:37am

The bucket sequence was, from memory:

0 min: Blue Bucket up
3 min: Yellow Bucket up, Blue down
6 min: Yellow Down, Red Up, FF15 start
8:30min: Red Down
9min: Red Up, Laser Start
11:30: Red down
12: Red up, "all comers" start
14:30: red down
15: red up, cat start
17:30: red down
18: Red up, Assymetric handicap start
 
To make matters worse, most of the time when I've been there the "all comers" (symetric kites, single sail, two sail double handers, foilers) has often been non-existant- but the sequence was inflexible.
 
The order is odd- especially as with the cats, the bulk of the fleet are Sprint 15s, so are slower than quite a lot of the assymetric fleet.
-_
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Telltale Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 14 at 8:34am
Its all very well getting multiple fleets away on time and at close intervals, however, at our club we don't have a PC or a "magic box", just good old pencil and paper with a watch. So how does he RO deal with finishes? Don't you get a raft of dinghies flooding through at 45 mins?
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