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The RS100 Owners Thread |
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Merlinboy 
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Joined: 03 Jul 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3169 |
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 Topic: The RS100 Owners ThreadPosted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:44pm |
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Hi Nick,
This started by me saying I honestly couldn't tell which sail was which yesterday when I saw them, and it struck me that it may cause trouble.
I didnt mean to stir anything up, it was just an observation.
I guess the misunderstanding stems from previous postings where it mentions "choosing your weapon", it would appear that people are still a tad confused at handicap level at least....although you and Chris seem to have answered that.
Timg [/QUOTE]
Tim I'm not sure anyone thinks you are trying to cause any trouble. But in fact you are like me a little confused and interested. It doesn't matter to me what goes on in 100 class racing, but when it encroaches on my handicap racing it does. Hence why i want to understand the mixed messages that are currently being posted here.
We all know the PY racing has its failing, but it needs to be controlled and made as fair as possible. I suspect that (like most RS classes) most of the 100 guys will be racing in club handicap races. Therefore IMHO there needs to be clear definition between sail/rig types and there needs to be a clear message about how the class is marketing itself. Is it 3 boats with 3 PY's or 1 boat with a reduced PY to cater for all wind ranges?
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Nick Peters
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Joined: 08 Feb 06 Location: England Online Status: Offline Posts: 192 |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:40pm |
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Here we go Tim...differentiation: All rigs should have 8.4 or 10.2 at the clew area - admittedly some do not and we were giving them out at the nationals - although far clearer as soon as you know is...8.4 foot length is shorter - clew is inside mainsheet and has a white clew swoosh. 10.2 clew is aft of mainsheet and has black clew swoosh. Yes, I know a race officer is not supposed to know that, which is why all sails have the numbering now.
While we are at it - the 7.4 has little roach, and a pink clew swoosh! Hard to miss.
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Nick
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asterix
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Joined: 01 Aug 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 621 |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:33pm |
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I think it is important not to confuse things further.
A process was followed with the RYA which gives the opportunity to establish a PY for each RS100 rig. A joint statement was developed and signed, clubs have been encouraged to return data for each rig separately. We shouldn't now put that at risk by muddying the waters with suggestions of allowing rig swapping within a regatta or series. Edited by asterix - 18 Oct 10 at 1:33pm |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:30pm |
This started by me saying I honestly couldn't tell which sail was which yesterday when I saw them, and it struck me that it may cause trouble.
I didnt mean to stir anything up, it was just an observation.
I guess the misunderstanding stems from previous postings where it mentions "choosing your weapon", it would appear that people are still a tad confused at handicap level at least....although you and Chris seem to have answered that.
Timg
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G.R.F.
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Joined: 10 Aug 08 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 4028 |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:21pm |
Well if you want to have a view, first you have to put your money where your mouth/view is don't you? Then you and the other D1 sailor can have a perfect time together each on his own rig not competing with each other... And my view, doesn't count any more or less than any of the others at the AGM where they were talking about it, however it does work in the windsurfing environment and I can't for the life of me see why folk are so close minded, it's only another category/class trophy. Those who want to race according to the status quo, one rig one cup one event are catered for already. This 'Open Class" is only a suggestion. Better that surely than a class that caters for only one body type and/or is sold only because it's a handicap bandit. What is wrong with you people?
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Nick Peters
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Joined: 08 Feb 06 Location: England Online Status: Offline Posts: 192 |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:19pm |
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Sorry, Captainslow, our mails crossed, but you can see, RS100 Class does not allow for swapping rigs within a regatta or series:
Whether thay end up with the same handicap or not depends on clubs and RYA. and the same applies to the D-One's new rig.
"Sounding as though we are making it up as we go along" is hardly fair unless you misinterprate rantings on a forum! Easily done...!
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Nick
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Nick Peters
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Joined: 08 Feb 06 Location: England Online Status: Offline Posts: 192 |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:08pm |
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Tim - that could almost have been written by me for the RS100 a year ago. The RS100 rules do not allow for swapping within a regatta or series either. So you are heading for exactly the same issue, are you not?
The added complication for all concerned is that there seems less difference between 8.4 and 10.2 over the course of varied sailing than one would have thought? Maybe you will find this for the D-One small rig - in a breeze it will almost certainly be faster for a given weight!
Time will sort this out - maybe they will be on one handicap? If that is how it goes then we will have created a very effective form of weight equalisation! For both our classes.
What is it you have a problem with in the short term?
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Nick
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CaptainSlow
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Joined: 27 Jul 10 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 75 |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 1:08pm |
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This is why I believe the D1 will prosper and the 100 struggle should the 100 be interchangable with rigs during series.
I looked at buying a 100 this year but would not of got upto speed in time for the nats so decided against it, more than likely I will purchase a single handed spinnaker boat at some point in the near future but my choice currently would be the D1. It seems the D1 as a class knows where it is heading and the 100 boys are making it up as they go along.
I personally do not believe people like GRF (only in his views) are good for a green field class.
Only my view...........
CS
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 12:49pm |
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Hi Chris,
That all sounds about right.
I just felt, should the need arise, for whatever reason, it maybe a good idea to be able to tell visually the difference.
As you say, and I agree, you can't tell from the sailors stature what rig he sails.
Please excuse me but I don't know how to create a link to the D-One thread where Jimbo asked the same questions, so here goes....
(quoted Rodney from D-One thread)
"The new rig D-Ones will race as a separate class and will use a different PY in handicap racing so there is no option for switching the rig, either in a regatta or over a series. The helms using this rig under 59 Kilos will be able to use the wings in the outboard position. In practice, in the early days, we can see the two classes sometimes sharing the start line, racing together, but as different classes and with different results. Kite halyard is the same for both rigs."
Timg |
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Merlinboy
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Joined: 03 Jul 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3169 |
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Posted: 18 Oct 10 at 12:49pm |
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I think you are missing my point slightly. If the boat is to have interchangeable rigs, then thats great! Is a big tick in the box for a lot of people. But the class needs 1 PY not 3. If each rig size is to be a different class of boat like the laser then the rigs need to be identifiable and not interchangeable between races in a series.
Whats stopping someone changing rig sizes at say the tiger trophy? Its very hard to police and definitely not in the spirit of the competition but it could happen.
RS400atC you can't really swap to the old rules Kite on a 5o5 as the halyard take off is a metre further up the mast. You could use a different cut, but i don't see the point really as the kite is manageable in just about anything.
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