Byte CII and weather helm

   My brothers CII has a very heavy help and I found it ver heavy the other day in a f5.

Okay fair enough, stong winds where it's hard to keep the boat flat yes ther will be weather helm but this happens in light winds too  

YES the boat is flat bus still seems to be heavy as iff its poped up a little but its right down as far as it goes.

Is the rudder just heavy or is something wrong?

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zailor Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Far too distracted from work Joined: 10 May 09 Location: Penparc Online Status: Offline Posts: 249	Post Options Post Reply Quote zailor Report Post Quote Reply Topic: Byte CII and weather helm Posted: 24 May 09 at 4:08pm
	My brothers CII has a very heavy help and I found it ver heavy the other day in a f5. Okay fair enough, stong winds where it's hard to keep the boat flat yes ther will be weather helm but this happens in light winds too YES the boat is flat bus still seems to be heavy as iff its poped up a little but its right down as far as it goes. Is the rudder just heavy or is something wrong?

radixon Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 27 Oct 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2407	Post Options Post Reply Quote radixon Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 24 May 09 at 5:37pm
	Fit the rudder and insert daggerboard Turn boat over and check to see it they are aligned, this may be the issue.

zailor Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Far too distracted from work Joined: 10 May 09 Location: Penparc Online Status: Offline Posts: 249	Post Options Post Reply Quote zailor Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 24 May 09 at 6:46pm
	Will do. Prahaps I should have checked that already

Jon Emmett Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 15 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 988	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jon Emmett Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 25 May 09 at 6:29pm
	Probably sailing with too much kicker. It is a shame you missed the class training at the weekend. We spent lots of timing looking at rig set up!
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zailor Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Far too distracted from work Joined: 10 May 09 Location: Penparc Online Status: Offline Posts: 249	Post Options Post Reply Quote zailor Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 25 May 09 at 7:20pm
	I took it out today in about 5-6 Knots maybe Wouldnt plane but definatley shifting. No cunningham conditions and the helm did feel lighter. I think it pop's up a little because I find the cleat doesnt hold very well. On most boats I have sailed hetting the rudder downhaul out of the cleat is a nightmare but this one opos out quite happy. At the time of the heavy helm it was a F5 running with big waves so no suprise but at times I hat to resort to the old school frying pan grip to rest my arms also reading up on the class rules I see your now alowed two traveler carrs (did i spell that right). Is that better that the solo carr? If no how do I put a new one on? I think i'm starting to like the CII now.....So much for the Europe Looks likr my brother's lost his boat Are there any other training events?

tack'ho Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 08 Feb 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1100	Post Options Post Reply Quote tack'ho Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 25 May 09 at 8:33pm
	Like the lazy, you have got to get the rudder all the way down and keep it there. I have a wing bolt and push the rudder down by hand and tighten the nut. Don't forget to loosen before trying to come ashore. And like a laser sail it flat, no really flat....no seriously flatter ps. Where are you i may be able to have a look if your in the home counties or the North East if the above doesn't solve it. (or i'll just ask Jon) Edited by tack'ho
	I might be sailing it, but it's still sh**e!

Jon Emmett Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 15 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 988	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jon Emmett Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 25 May 09 at 9:19pm
	There are very few (if any?) boats that plane in 5/6 knots! For the rudder buy a new cleat and some stretchy rope and put in a purchase system. I haven't used the new traveller but I am sure it makes it much easier for sailing. On another point you need a consistent angle of heel for a Laser which is just off flat (to hold the centreboard securely in it's casing so it doesn't wobble about too much.
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zailor Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Far too distracted from work Joined: 10 May 09 Location: Penparc Online Status: Offline Posts: 249	Post Options Post Reply Quote zailor Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 25 May 09 at 10:26pm
	The Center board has a good snug fit. Just a question why streachy rope and not non streach? Would I use a layed rope or the usuall Excel pro or whater its called?

Jon Emmett Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 15 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 988	Post Options Post Reply Quote Jon Emmett Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 25 May 09 at 10:54pm
	Centreboards do not have a nice snug fit in Lasers and wobble about if the level of heel is not constant. If you have non-stretch rope and it slips a couple of mm then the rudder raises a corresponding amount. If the rope is stretchy and pulled really tight then the rudder is held really tight and if it slips very slightly the rudder is still held really tight. By using a 3:1 purchase system if the rope slips for example 3mm then in the stock there is only 1mm slipage. You would not want to use Excel pro as this is a low stretch rope.
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laser193713 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 13 May 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 889	Post Options Post Reply Quote laser193713 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 26 May 09 at 10:30am
	yes this is true for all dinghys with lifting rudders, I dont understand why laser stock a dyneema or vectran rudder downhaul with the XD range!? I now use my old outhaul control line (which is stretchy!!!) and also stretchy lines hold in cleats better. In the laser most tillers require this line to be tied rather than cleated, this makes the stretchy rope even more important because its even harder to keep it tight especially when launching into a big sea at stokes bay! The 700 i bought also had low stretch rope for this and it wouldnt cleat despite the cleat being in good condition, this type of rope goes hard under tension so the cleat finds it hard to dig in, so it slips more.