| Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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| Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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| Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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List classes of boat for sale |
laser 4000? |
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49erGBR735HSC 
Really should get out more 
Joined: 30 Mar 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1991 |
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 Topic: laser 4000?Posted: 17 Nov 06 at 1:46pm |
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The 4000 is more suited to sailing in displacement mode than the 29er due to tweaking lines for the pole and the difference in hull form. The difference in PYs may be attributed to the fact that the 4000 performs better in lighter winds so it increases the overall performance of the boat over a broader spectrum. Stepped back a few times onto the 4000 from the 49er and it suprised me quite a bit how much wind you could still run deep in and for it to pay, my gut reaction was to hot up and get the crew on the wire. Good thing the crew knew the boat better. The 29er will feel the more livley of the boats although it may not be any quicker.
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English Dave
Really should get out more
Joined: 10 Aug 06 Location: Northern Ireland Online Status: Offline Posts: 682 |
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Posted: 17 Nov 06 at 11:14am |
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If you want average then the PY for a 29er is 924 and a L4000 is 906. But the point is that there is no best all round boat. That's why we all sail different boats. You choose the one that best suits your circumstances, be it cost, size, performance, local fleets, etc. |
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mathew
Newbie 
Joined: 17 Nov 06 Location: Ireland Online Status: Offline Posts: 1 |
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Posted: 17 Nov 06 at 10:43am |
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Does anyone know which is better for each of the points of sailing?? Im not too worked up on stability nor weight, but performance and speed in all wind conditions and at each point of sailing... which is the best alrounder??
Thanks!! |
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glewis
Groupie 
Joined: 05 May 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 79 |
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Posted: 10 Nov 06 at 12:58pm |
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Had a 4000 and they are a pig to haul out of the water but very rewarding once the wind is up. Also sailed a 29er and I think they are a great boat, twitchy, responsive, good fun. I think the 4000 is more stable, it goes onit's it's ear for a couple of seconds giving you the chance to do omething about it. You will fall in however and once inverted, takes two people to haul it back up, but if stability is really that important to you, buy a Flying Fifteen. Both the 4000 and 29er are great boats but as with most things, practice makes perfect - both will be very rewarding with enough time on the boat and all the capsizes will seem worth it once you've got the thing doing what you want in any conditions.
Giles |
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Hector
Really should get out more
Joined: 10 May 04 Location: Otley, Yorkshire Online Status: Offline Posts: 750 |
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Posted: 09 Nov 06 at 1:57pm |
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Turnturtle - not sure how that comment is relevant or contributes anything to this discussion but then neither does this link! http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2 038&KW=turnturtle&PN=0&TPN=2 Edited by Hector |
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JimC
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Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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Posted: 07 Nov 06 at 4:10pm |
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Having tried it in both its an awful lot more practical to sit on the lee side of a Vortex coaching a novice trapeze helm than it is to do the same thing in an RS600... |
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English Dave
Really should get out more
Joined: 10 Aug 06 Location: Northern Ireland Online Status: Offline Posts: 682 |
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Posted: 07 Nov 06 at 3:40pm |
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I am the English bloke in a Northern Irish sailing club. My Australian counterpart at a Swords SC outside Dublin is called Aussie Dave. Very creative, these Irish The Aussies seem to think that Skiffs can only be 18' or 12' which rules out the 49er, I14 etc. I personally find the word skiff far easier to type than high performance assymetric planing dinghy. However, to avoid controversy, and bearing in mind that I sl*gged the Americans yesterday and the Irish today, I'll duck the issue and sail catamarans. (Although I did have a Vortex a few years ago. Is it, isn't it, etc?) |
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Jack Sparrow
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Joined: 08 Feb 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2965 |
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Posted: 07 Nov 06 at 2:32pm |
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but your called English Dave.... come on stand up to those Southern pansies  |
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English Dave
Really should get out more
Joined: 10 Aug 06 Location: Northern Ireland Online Status: Offline Posts: 682 |
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Posted: 07 Nov 06 at 12:25pm |
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Furtive, Mast stiffness is all relative. Yes you can depower the 4k easy enough but the flex tip that opens and closes the top section of the 29er sail makes for an easier ride without the need to work the tiller all the time to stay on the power. This is probably most noticeable upwind in marginal but gusty trapese conditions. But I'm no expert, even in my own class (not L4000 or 29er) so I'll butt out on this one. Point about stability being a priority still valid though. Most high-perf assymetric sailors (I'm apparently not allowed to use the word Skiff in case the Aussies object) accept that wipe-outs are part of the deal. And after a few flips your sandwiches will have been long gone!
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JimC
Really should get out more
Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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Posted: 07 Nov 06 at 12:16pm |
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Maybe, but I always used to sit hove to and eat my energy bar or whatever (not a boat to take sandwiches in) in anything up to F5 in my Cherub - and indeed now do the same thing in my IC. Its hardly a measure of stability. If you want to sit steady in a 29er between races then just rig some backing lines. I see the gust response of the rig as being crucial. It doesn't matter what strings you've pulled when the gust front comes in at 2 x windspeed: its just down to how the rig behaves dynamically. Put a bit of twist in a dynamic rig and its about three times as survivable. I learned this in a big way when I upgraded my Cherub from a powerful but unyielding tin mast to a quite superbly dynamic carbon one. The top windspeed we could handle the boat in went up by a good 10 knots simply because the dynamic rig gives you time to react. Edited by JimC |
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