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The dinghy market

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Nudge View Drop Down
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    Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 12:26pm

A question of two halves:

 

At any one time there must be hundreds of people on the market to buy a new dinghy. I therefore find it surprising that the larger dinghy manufacturers don’t make public the type of boats they are currently developing. For example it’s quite well known when the next generation Ford or Vauxhall car is to be launched and the type of person it is aimed at. Therefore if you have a loyalty to a certain manufacturer or want a particular type of dinghy you know what is going to be on sale in the near future. How many people have bought a boat only to have felt disappointed when another similar but better boat comes on the market?

 

I am sure there will be many people will say that if rival manufacturers know what they are currently developing they will also produce exactly the same boat, but why would they? Surely every manufacturer is looking for a new target market to sell their goods, so why would they produce a boat which would have a direct competitor?

 

 

Now this brings me on to my other question:

 

Over the years dinghy manufacturers have developed dinghies for small sections of the dinghy market. Now I always hear that such niche markets seldom exist and if a new boat comes on the market there is always a direct competitor. Well I do feel that there is a particular large market which has been ignored. That is for an ADULT roto-moulded plastic single-handed dinghy (non-trapeze, non-spinnaker so as to keep the handling within the abilities of the general weekend racer). And please don’t anyone say that there already is one in such form as the Topaz – beg to differ that it is a dinghy designed for serious racing.

 

Also with roto-moulded boats being so robust, the racing would indeed be incredibly close since you could take more risks as if you got it wrong it would hopefully just bounce off. You could then simply just take your penalty turns instead of having to contact your insurance company which you’ll likely do with wood/FRP/GRP boats.

 

Lastly I believe that roto-moulded boats do get a bad press and on the whole I agree, but I do feel there is a place for them for those who regularly race rather than just learners, kids and for family day sailing. I guess over the next hours/days I’ll find out if you agree.

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tack'ho View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tack'ho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 12:41pm

Also with roto-moulded boats being so robust, the racing would indeed be incredibly close since you could take more risks as if you got it wrong it would hopefully just bounce off. You could then simply just take your penalty turns instead of having to contact your insurance company which you’ll likely do with wood/FRP/GRP boats.

 

There may be a few rules issues with that!!

 

In esence though what you are after is a roto-moulded laser?

I might be sailing it, but it's still sh**e!
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Matt Jackson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 1:00pm

The current RRS are geared towards avoiding collision virtually at all cost but I guess there could be race series where the RRS were altered or dropped in favour of a more 'thrills'n'spills' idea. Could be fun but even if the boats bounce of each other the soft bit in the middle could get a bit damaged - your insurance company would soon get fed up of personal injury claims!

I'm not sure a Laser is the right model for this though as you'd need a bit of power to make it interesting... how about rotomoulded MX Rays?



Edited by Matt Jackson
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 1:42pm
The thought of a fleet that is even more bump and bash than the Lasers is quite an intimidating one. Personally If I want to play that game I go to the fairground.

I would have thought though that the prime reason for avoiding bump and bash was the penalty turns rather than the damage, so I wouldn't have thought your dodgems class would actually have any more collisions than occur at the moment. I'm sure that only a tiny percentage of collisions resulty in an insurancve claim. I've never had aa coliision that resulted in such damage.

Edited by JimC
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Chew my RS View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chew my RS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 1:56pm

I wouldn't say that a plastic adult single hander was much of a gap in the market - the material is largely irrelevant.  Sure it might be a bit more impact resistant, but it essentially the same boat as a Laser.  I don't think Laser sailors keep their distance for fear of damaging their boats yet you rarely see one with a hole in the side.

Having said that, it is probably just a matter of time before someone (Topper probably) produce a rotomoulded adult single-hander.  Not because the material is better, or it is aimed at different people, but because it is cheaper.  You can therefore make rip-off Lasers for half the price.  Unstayed rigs (like the Laser) are probably quite good for plastic boats as there is no problem with rig tension.

There is a lot of marketing twaddle about roto-moulded boats.  Their main benefit  is the cost of manufacture, not robustness/ lack of maintance.  An adult roto-moulded boat would be relatively low performance by modern standards, but cheap.  There is nothing wrong with that, and the stats show that most sailing is not done in high performance craft, but it will a long time before anyone makes a plastic skiff.

Finally, not all plastic boats are roto-moulded.  The Topper isn't and neither, I think,  is the new Open Bic (despite what the Y&Y test claims).  Perhaps an adult size Bic?  Incidentally, that was a good review Y&Y - much more informative than previous ones.

 



Edited by Chew my RS
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tack'ho View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tack'ho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 2:33pm
Not sure if topper would wade in.  They would be competeing with themselves.  They market the topaz XV12TG or whatever they call is as a 'serious' race boat. They know that the have pretty much given up on the hard core racer and are now all about families, kids and newbies. 
I might be sailing it, but it's still sh**e!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Nudge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 2:37pm

**************************

“Also with roto-moulded boats being so robust, the racing would indeed be incredibly close since you could take more risks as if you got it wrong it would hopefully just bounce off. You could then simply just take your penalty turns instead of having to contact your insurance company which you’ll likely do with wood/FRP/GRP boats.”

 

 **************************

 

I said ‘close’ rather than having a class of boat which is more a contact sport. How many people sail quite cautiously/ conservatively and always tack or bear away rather than cross a starboard tack boat. By giving people confidence in a class of boat which they could then take reasonable risks (still fully in accordance with the RSS) they would then learn the skills to win races or championships in other classes rather than continue to finish mid-fleet.

 

Not everyone has progressed through the ranks of Optimists, Topper, etc… many adults learn to sail when they are actually adults so haven’t gone through the learning curve of taking such knocks and bumps in large fleet racing and therefore lack the confidence to get the results they should because of being so risk-averse. [For example, what I mean by this is that kids climb trees because they don’t appreciate this risks of what could happen, how many adults do you see climbing trees – they know what could happen if they fell out?]

 

Appreciate all your comments regarding this, keep it up……..

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 2:43pm

Originally posted by JimC

I've never had aa coliision that resulted in (insurance claims).

I've had two, but both in keelboats where bumps can easily result in big bills. I've also had a crew-member hurt in a collision. They really are best avoided.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 2:47pm

Originally posted by Nudge

How many people sail quite cautiously/ conservatively and always tack or bear away rather than cross a starboard tack boat.

None in any of the classes I've ever sailed!

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chew my RS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 06 at 3:15pm

Originally posted by tack'ho

Not sure if topper would wade in.  They would be competeing with themselves.  They market the topaz XV12TG or whatever they call is as a 'serious' race boat. They know that the have pretty much given up on the hard core racer and are now all about families, kids and newbies. 

I can't see Laser making one for precisely the same reason, but I figured Topper were the plastic kings.  Surely no-one thinks the Topaz is a suitable boat for adults, let alone a race boat?  I suppose LDC could launch a superiszed Tera, but I don't think that would fit with their brand image.



Edited by Chew my RS
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