Hardest nationals to win?

For a start, I didn't say all the crew in those classes was just rail meat! Many of them have skilled jobs, but in some yacht classes not everyone has duties as complex and difficult as in say  a 12' skiff, A Class or Laser.

Secondly, won the J/24 nationals many years ago but in a good fleet (a couple of multiple Etchells world champs, a couple of America's Cup skippers, Fireball, IOR, F15 world champs etc). It was a classic pierhead jump; zero training, zero knowledge, I just got dragged around the course by the world champs and America's Cup winners on the boat. 

It took vastly less work and skill than winning or placing in other nationals, even the "restricted" ones like F15 Classics, Radial Masters, and windsurfer weight divisions or disciplines.

My 707, SB3 record is pretty poor since we don't have them!

Don't do all that much big-boat stuff these days but I get the occasional glimpse of what's needed.Lost the trailable states (on tactics/bow/mainsheet) by 1 pt to the national champ in our closest equivalent to the 707/SB3 (and we were not sailing well!).  Ran bow on a British boat which I think was UK IMS national champ (it was Commodore's Cup winner, RORC Yacht of  the Year about 4 times, multiple Fastnet class winner etc) in the IMS nats. Won the fleet championships in Etchells against 2 world champs. Did the "pumps" on a F52 (Oz/UK ownership at the time) in a duel between Grant (Alinghi/Australia II) and Kenny Read (on Esmerelda) off Newport RI. Taken (very) minor silverware as watch captain in the Hobart. Occasional runs with names like Shockwave, Ragamuffin, Xena, running bow in a 12 Metre race off Newport RI etc etc etc.

Generally, the same sort of practise and training would not have given the same sort of position in say a hot dinghy class.

Obviously the good yachties are very, very good. It's just that not EVERYONE on the boat always has to be that good as far as I can see. You can carry someone as crappy as me if you have to.


Edited by CT249

Yes, I'm from Aus. In most of main yacht classes we share, the standard here is comparable to that of the UK (ie world champ wins or runner-up in Farr 40, Mumm 30, Flying 15, Dragon, Etchells over the last couple of years).

I never said that the Etchells, Star or J/24 worlds is an easy touch. As I said earlier, I just think that SOME yacht classes can afford to carry SOME people who are not really up to the standard of winning a nationals - as I wasn't in J/24s at that time.

Secondly, the smaller number of competitors in yacht classes surely has an effect.

EDIT; Hell, why am I arguing on THIS side of the dispute? OK, you win......to win something like a J/24 nats every member of the crew must be a LEGEND!!!! Even the pierhead jumper who had no clue!




Edited by CT249

In general I'd suggest it is easier to win in a small fleet than a large fleet.

In a small fleet you can get away with errors and recover from bad starts - in a large fleet if you start 3rd row you have a mountain to climb to find clear air - in a small fleet you can crack off find a lane and off you go ...

Also the luck element is nutralised more in a bigger fleet ...

Rick

Edited by Guest#260

Originally posted by Stefan Lloyd Originally posted by JimC It may well be just as difficult for the seven to win from a ten boat keelboat fleet . Some recent Nationals attendances: SB3 52 J24 41 Salcombe Yawl 53 - who'd have guessed that Dragon 36 Etchells 36 The venerable XOD 79 So what 10-boat keelboat fleet were we talking about? These numbers are up there with all but a small number of the biggest dinghy fleets. Now remind us how many boats were at the last Cherub nationals. Clue, think of  a number less than 20.

I am sure there as many minority keelboat classes as there are dinghy classes ...

But ... there are few keelboat classes that get 100+ boats.

Rick

Originally posted by Stefan Lloyd Some recent Nationals attendances:

I could be wrong Stefan, But I don't think many of those have 9 or more crew on board like my rather light hearted example...