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slowing down using your body

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tmoore View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tmoore Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: slowing down using your body
    Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 8:59pm

in a club race on the start line i often heel the boat right on me so my body goes in the water and slows down my approach to the start line or trail my leg in the water. i got protested for this, what is your view and what rules should i be looking at (is there an online rule book anywhere?)

the stupid thing is the protesting boat then went on to hit me (tryed to get between me and the comitee boat when the gap was about 6") and did no penalty turns. either way, the results for the series do not change as i have 2races in hand.

you opinions please

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Smight at BBSC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Smight at BBSC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 9:02pm
I can see anything wrong with this, i do it all the time, it's not like your gaining a distinct advantage. Then again i don't know all the rules and this could be conceived as dangerous.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Spyderman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 9:15pm
When you stick a hand or a foot or any other body part into the water to slow down, you break rule 42. "Propel" in the rules does not only mean forward.

From the RRS:
42 PROPULSION
42.1 Basic Rule
Except when permitted in rule 42.3 or 45, a boat shall compete by using only the wind and water to increase, maintain or decrease her speed. Her crew may adjust the trim of sails and hull, and perform other acts of seamanship, but shall not otherwise move their bodies to propel the boat.

It is an advantage to keep a boat in place just below the starting line next to the committee vessel, because you can then start as top windward boat. If you keep your position by sticking a foot in the water so you slow down, you propel the boat with a negative force and that is illegal.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tmoore Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 9:21pm

ok, thanks for the explanation spyderman. it doesnt affect my results and i was asking from a point of interest. does 'using the water' refer to, is it merely waves, tide etc or does it extend to anything else?

in theory i could protest any boat which heels enough for the crew to be hit by water in this case? i know this is taking the rule very literally but in theory i wold be well within my rights and should win a protest (although not very sportsmanshiply - if thats a word). I wouldnt do this, just interested in finding loopholes etc in the rules.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 9:26pm
Originally posted by tmoore

ok, thanks for the explanation spyderman. it doesnt affect my results and i was asking from a point of interest. does 'using the water' refer to, is it merely waves, tide etc or does it extend to anything else?

in theory i could protest any boat which heels enough for the crew to be hit by water in this case? i know this is taking the rule very literally but in theory i wold be well within my rights and should win a protest (although not very sportsmanshiply - if thats a word). I wouldnt do this, just interested in finding loopholes etc in the rules.

If it went to protest, it would be a matter of proving it was deliberate action and taken in order to slow the boat.

 

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tmoore View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tmoore Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 9:34pm
ds it matter whether it was deliberat or not? you cant be absolved from hitting anothe boat by accident......
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Post Options Post Options   Quote AlexM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 9:58pm
i guess it could be hard to prove if your bum is just dragging in the water for a few seconds..(i.e. lull in the wind or header or dropped the mainsheet ) however if you got your leg in the water that is cheating
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Spyderman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 08 at 10:46pm
I think you can apply the same test as for the rest of rule 42

From the Rule 42 Interpretations for the 2005 - 2008 Racing Rules of Sailing
Basic 4:
Except when permitted under rule 42.3, any single action of the body that propels the boat (in any direction) with the effect of one stroke of a paddle is prohibited. 


So if your body accidentally hit the water without that effect you don't break rule 42. But if it has the same effect as the paddle, you are up the creek without one.


Edited by Spyderman
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Post Options Post Options   Quote radixon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Aug 08 at 12:36pm
If you chuck your weight at the back of the boat that will slow you down without breaking rule 42
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Post Options Post Options   Quote FreshScum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Aug 08 at 1:06pm
radixon, if you mean 'go and sit at the back of the boat so the transom drags' that would be fine. But if you mean 'throw yourself to the back of the boat, and then stop suddenly', like an ooch in reverse, I don't think that would be allowed.
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