Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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List classes of boat for sale |
59er v rs400 |
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nick.r ![]() Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: 07 Jul 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 13 |
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my dad and me are looking for the thrills and spills of skiff sailing without to much work. We've been looking at the rs400 because it has a good racing circiut and club racing at our club. But, we went to this years dinghy show and saw the 59er. It looked like a really well sorted boat, the PY is around 905 so its pretty fast. does anyone have any opinions on which one to go for? |
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Chris Noble ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Nov 04 Location: Scotland Online Status: Offline Posts: 710 |
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400 will have more spares and in the long run costs far less, i dont think there is a big class for the 59er in britain at present, it really depends on your overall weight, the 59er is a BIG boat and requires a lot of working and / or a lot of weight combined to get any real full use from it
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Competitive Boat Insurance From Noble Marine
FOR SALE: I14 2 Masts 2 poles 3 Booms, Foils Kites/Mains/Jibs too many to list. |
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nick.r ![]() Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: 07 Jul 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 13 |
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We weigh 160kg
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Stefan Lloyd ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 03 Aug 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1599 |
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We've had the "What is a skiff?" debate before and concluded there is no absolute definition. That said, good boats as the certainly are, I wouldn't ever call an RS400 a skiff. It's a plastic Merlin Rocket with an asymmetric: not surprising as the designer more or less invented the modern Merlin Rocket hull shape. I'm not sure "skiff" and "not too much work" go together either. Part of the point is that they are demanding to sail. All that said, going for the class with good racing at your club is usually the right decision.
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redback ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 16 Mar 04 Location: Tunbridge Wells Online Status: Offline Posts: 1502 |
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I'm in agreement with Stefan. You can't make a boat go fast without using some energy. The 400 is extremely hard work in a breeze and being an asymmetric that means upwind and down. Boats with conventional spinnakers can be a bit less energetic downwind - but then they aren't going so fast through the water. I too wouldn't consider a 400 a skiff, fine boat that it is. Whatever you do don't buy a 59er if they sail 400s at your club. Edited by redback |
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Wave Rider ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 27 Oct 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 909 |
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Oi symmetric boats can be just as hard work, faireballs and many fast sail classes are pretty hsrd work to keep going fast in a blow
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-[Franko]-
Chew Valley Lake Sailing Club RS600 933 |
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Chris _Laser2 ![]() Newbie ![]() ![]() Joined: 15 Aug 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 23 |
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Tell that to a FD or 505 sailor :D You considered a B14? Edited by Chris _Laser2 |
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Boatless!
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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They are very very different boats! The 400 has a tiny spinnaker, and you spend an awful lot of time soaking downind with the crew on the leeward side. Its a superb lighter wind boat which is very suited to moderate sized waters. Its a pretty easy boat to sail, but seems to be difficult to sail really well - a lot of talented sailors in other classes at my club never seemed to be fast in them. Its a roll tacky boat which is well suited to tight tactical racing. On the other hand the first time when I crewed in one after Cherubs I put the kite up and was waiting for something to happen. It didn't! The 59er on the other hand has a big kite by any standards, will probably struggle in confined waters, but has a top speed probably twice that of the RS400. I bet the crew spends a lot less time on the lee side than the 400. I also suspect that the racing will be more what I call strategic rather than tactical, where the emphasis is more on getting clear air and the right general approach upwind and downwind rather than tacking and covering on every tiny shift. |
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Jim C , you say 400 never seem to go that fast !!, I don't sail them , rather I sail fast boats with hull assisted stability , ie two , of twin wire variety and be spinnakered and I gnow fast,(when not out in the ole heron) your comments seem slightly off. I have seen 400's on countless windy days - when they excell because of their easily managed smaller sail areas , infact one regatta they were pacing cats offwind - absolute honking flat water , as for "Skiffs" all fell over so frequently they hadn't a look in , nor when they where upright signifcarntly fester. 400's must have been hitting high teens of gnotts if not in 20's , Cherub must be fastest mono out if its doubling that , They certainly are very different boats with widely differing performance envelopes , the Cherub certailly kicks off first , but the 400 is no slouch given wind .
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Shingle ![]() Posting king ![]() ![]() Joined: 11 Jul 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 111 |
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Being one of a rare breed of sailor who sails a 59er, I can say it's a far more rewarding experience than a 400. Admittedly, more skills are required to sail it than a 400, and there maybe times when it is a real blow when it is better to be a spectator, whereas the 400 would be sailable. The 59er is a missed opportunity due to lack of marketing, and the LDC RS association machine, which has stifled the boat. It is an excellent well-sorted boat that can compete boat for boat with an RS800 in light airs. Ultimately it depends what you want from your sailing class racing, or some performance. The market is crying out for a sorted two man single wire boat for those helms who are unable to trapeze helm. Until then I’ll enjoy the 59er. |
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Drink Feck girls!
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