Classic Boat PY's

   I aplaud what the CRVDA is doing, and if I had my old Scorpion 625 I'd be there.  I wouldn't be worrying about the handicap though, getting the right side of a windshift makes more difference than a few points on the PY.
As it is, I lust after the next chance to sail my 4000.
A small question, if all the boats are old, surely its their relative performance that counts - has that changed over the years, or have they all got slower together?  

Edited by redback

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redback Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 16 Mar 04 Location: Tunbridge Wells Online Status: Offline Posts: 1502	Post Options Post Reply Quote redback Report Post Quote Reply Topic: Classic Boat PY's Posted: 11 Aug 04 at 7:17pm
	I aplaud what the CRVDA is doing, and if I had my old Scorpion 625 I'd be there. I wouldn't be worrying about the handicap though, getting the right side of a windshift makes more difference than a few points on the PY. As it is, I lust after the next chance to sail my 4000. A small question, if all the boats are old, surely its their relative performance that counts - has that changed over the years, or have they all got slower together? Edited by redback

Rupert Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956	Post Options Post Reply Quote Rupert Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Aug 04 at 4:59pm
	Surely sailing a boat you enjoy sailing is the point? Some enjoy being stretched by the boat, others prefer tight compitition in a simpler boat. Still others just like the feel/look of the boat they sail. As far as classic Portsmouth Numbers go, if you sail a boat designed before 1965 and more than 25 years old, why not come to a Classic and Vintage Racing Dinghy Association event? We use modified 1965 handicaps, so bypassing the problems above. Boats range from Vintage N12s through Fireflies and other Fairey boats, to classic racing machines like Hornets, Ospreys and Jollyboats. Wood or GRP welcome. The next event is over the August bank holiday at Roadford Lake in Devon. Racing on the water is competitive for some and more relaxed for others, as befits classic handicap sailing. Expect a warm welcome, and don't worry if your boat is the "shed" described above. CVRDA is about using boats, not polishing them. Mind you, beautiful boats also take part! Find more on www.cvrda.org.uk

fizzicist Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Far too distracted from work Joined: 06 Aug 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 305	Post Options Post Reply Quote fizzicist Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Aug 04 at 3:41pm
	A bit OT, but what happened to the mutterings of PY's changing with the wind strengths that I heard so much about years back. Look at the relative performance of a Vortex in a F2 and the a F6! I stand by redback's comments - get something you can't cope with and learn - it's more fun than arguing about who beat who in a slow boat.
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redback Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Visit Member's Homepage Really should get out more Joined: 16 Mar 04 Location: Tunbridge Wells Online Status: Offline Posts: 1502	Post Options Post Reply Quote redback Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Aug 04 at 1:28pm
	If it encourages sailing all well and good. However I think the maths are probably suspect. I imagine the RYA hardly collect enough data to provide an accurate PY for any class - let alone sub classes. Further the relative performance of different boats in different wind strengths varies enormously. We are in danger of this all getting too time consuming and a distraction from what we are really trying to achieve. My advice - get yourself a boat which is just faster than you can handle and learn how to race it.

Ian S Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Groupie Joined: 18 May 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 68	Post Options Post Reply Quote Ian S Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 11 Aug 04 at 1:04pm
	What's the general concensus regarding a different (slower) PY for Classic Boats? We often hear from certain classes that the older boats cannot compete against the newer ones which may have a different hull shape, and that accordingly in order to encourage people to buy and race older boats within that class, these older boats should receive some form of PY amendment. For me certain points begin to stand out: 1) The PY of the class is a combination of both the older and newer boats, rather than the old boats being slower, perhaps the new boats are simply faster and so they should have a different (faster) PY. The existing PY could then continue for the older boats. 2). The better sailors in any class tend to be more serious about the sport and invest more of their time and money in it, ending up with newer boats. Older boats may be sailed by less committed sailors and therefore whilst the boats may be competitive, their crews perhaps aren't. 3). A lot of the so called Classic boats are little more than sheds, with 20 year old foils, sails and rigs. A poor condition boat will never be competitive, altering it's PY will then give it an unfair advantage over boats both within it's own class and those in other classes if handicap racing. The concept of classic PY's will increasingly become more and more prevelant within our sport, I feel it is only a matter of time before classes like the Enterprises and GP's start to consider the issue, and what about old Lasers, Toppers and Mirrors. Whilst classic or novice categories within a class are all well and good, when a classic PY for one class gives it an unfair advantage over boats in a different class it becomes a different issue. ciao Ian