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Future Olympic Classes?
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Scooby_simon View Drop Down
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    Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 2:14pm
Originally posted by Tornado_ALIVE

Originally posted by Scooby_simon

Originally posted by Wave Rider

Are tornado's the 49er of the cat world?

 

No, the 49er is the Tornado of the mono world (and a lot slower too)

Wrong again.

I would say the 49er equivalent in the cat world would be the F-18.  I mean no offence here but both are heavier, slower, mass produced, poorer quality, and offer larger fleet racing.

The Tornado equivalent in the mono world is without a doupt the 18 foot skiff.  At the cutting edge off performance and production techneques.  And whilst they are raced in good numbers (The Tornado more so) they do not have quiet the same numbers in fleet racing.  But the average quality of sailor is a lot higher due to the expense of the boats and how challenging they are to sail.

 

TA - I'd aagree with this, I was just poking fun at the 49er as some people think it's the fastest thing on the planet

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Posts: 271 		Post Options Post Options   Quote NeilP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 1:43pm

For the average-to-good sailor, the FD would be way faster in 25 knots and waves, and I was talking about entertainment for the people who really matter, ie the sailors. I personally don't give a stuff what spectators or TV viewers think. Whichever slot the FD went for, I'm not keen for it to happen, and I VERY much doubt that ISAF would ever admit that they made a mistake dropping the FD. So it's all pretty academic really. I'll go on sailing my FD and leave the world of the unenlightened to sail what they want!!

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Posts: 962 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 1:36pm

Originally posted by NeilP

Still don't think the FD should return to the 5-ring circus, and any class that isn't currently Olympic should think hard. Many drawbacks, including MASSIVE pressure on the integrity of the class rules (the search for speed causes that - FD class has extremely robust and well-policed rules), and the influx of "rock stars" every 4 years who then flood the market with used gear when they don't get selected! Class ends up being run for the benefit of selection processes, not sailors. If your class is not Olympic, just pray it stays that way.

There was a discussion and a poll on the Contender e-group some time ago about trying to gain Olympic status or not. I'm sure some of you are are aware that the Contender was designed for this purpose and easily won the trials but was not selected. The class does get asked now and then to act as a benchmark for new trialls though.

There was not a huge reply to the poll but it was fairly conclusive that we didn't want anything to do with the Olympics. Interestingly though the votes for 'yes' and 'Don't care' were tied.
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True, but there aren't so many owner drivers in  18's and tornados, rather top class jockeys in works boats (18's) and people doing olympic campaigns in the tornado funded in part by national sailing associations.
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Posts: 1599 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Stefan Lloyd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 10:59am

Originally posted by Tornado_ALIVE

But the average quality of sailor is a lot higher due to the expense of the boats and how challenging they are to sail.

I'd have thought the expense of the boat would be linked to the wealth of the sailor, not their sailing talent. That has certainly been my experience in keelboats. The owners of 40-footers are not better sailors than owners of 24-footers: just richer ones.
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Tornado_ALIVE View Drop Down
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Posts: 611 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Tornado_ALIVE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 10:53am
Originally posted by Scooby_simon

Originally posted by Wave Rider

Are tornado's the 49er of the cat world?

 

No, the 49er is the Tornado of the mono world (and a lot slower too)

Wrong again.

I would say the 49er equivalent in the cat world would be the F-18.  I mean no offence here but both are heavier, slower, mass produced, poorer quality, and offer larger fleet racing.

The Tornado equivalent in the mono world is without a doupt the 18 foot skiff.  At the cutting edge off performance and production techneques.  And whilst they are raced in good numbers (The Tornado more so) they do not have quiet the same numbers in fleet racing.  But the average quality of sailor is a lot higher due to the expense of the boats and how challenging they are to sail.

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Posts: 988 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Jon Emmett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 10:27am

It is interesting but several of the top 49ers have come from single trapeze, symetrical kite boats such as 470s and 505s. Just because people sail the 49er does not mean they do not 'get' other boats. Many of the top crews from the games have been taking time out in a variety of other classes.

 

No obviously I am baised but I know which is faster in 25knots on the solent... the 49er! As for entertainment I know from my non sailing mates that the 49ers are seen as by far the best classes to watch on TV.

 

By the sound of it not every FD sailor would like to see the class in the Olympics but my understanding is would it not go for the Men's double handed (470) rather than Open double handed spot (going from Dinghysolutions comments).
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NeilP View Drop Down
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Posts: 271 		Post Options Post Options   Quote NeilP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 10:20am
Well said Blobby. 49er sailors will never "get" the FD, they are totally different boats. 49er is good fun in moderate breeze and flat water, and in those conditions very fast, but in 25 knots and a Solent chop, the FD will be far more entertaining, and get you round a course faster than just about any other boat. That doesn't make it any better or worse than the 49er, just different. Still don't think the FD should return to the 5-ring circus, and any class that isn't currently Olympic should think hard. Many drawbacks, including MASSIVE pressure on the integrity of the class rules (the search for speed causes that - FD class has extremely robust and well-policed rules), and the influx of "rock stars" every 4 years who then flood the market with used gear when they don't get selected! Class ends up being run for the benefit of selection processes, not sailors. If your class is not Olympic, just pray it stays that way.
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Blobby View Drop Down
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Posts: 779 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Blobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 6:36am

No to both of you.

The Tornado is the FD of the Cat world and vice versa.

The F16 is the 49er of the Cat world and vice versa.

And I really don't care that one is faster than the other...that argument is pointless and boring

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Scooby_simon View Drop Down
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Posts: 2415 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 05 at 12:11am

Originally posted by Wave Rider

Are tornado's the 49er of the cat world?

 

No, the 49er is the Tornado of the mono world (and a lot slower too)

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