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Who was out this weekend?.....
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jeffers View Drop Down
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    Posted: 28 May 08 at 7:57am
Originally posted by NickA


.. as for beating phantoms ... especially vandercraft phantoms ... forget it.


The Vandercraft ones are not so bad, they have a tendancy to break at the wrong (or right) moments... It is the Ovi ones that I am worried about!

Although the 8.1 does given them a good run for their money in most winds, I was pleased and surprised..
Paul
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Posts: 3169 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Merlinboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 08 at 8:39am

Originally posted by jeffers

Originally posted by NickA


.. as for beating phantoms ... especially vandercraft phantoms ... forget it.


The Vandercraft ones are not so bad, they have a tendancy to break at the wrong (or right) moments... It is the Ovi ones that I am worried about!

Although the 8.1 does given them a good run for their money in most winds, I was pleased and surprised..

 

Enlighten me? I have seen very few Vandercraft Epoxy boats break, seen a few GRP ones but never an epoxy boat!!
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Posts: 784 		Post Options Post Options   Quote NickA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 08 at 12:44pm

I am told that the breaking Vandercraft phantom story is bogus.  One single  bloke (at burgfield was it?) bumped his phant and knocked the front end off it.  Boat replaced I think. 

Those foam epoxy hulls are pretty bomb-proof for the weight.  I've put a small hole in mine capsizing onto a spiky rock but the damage was extremely localised and quickly fixed with a blob of fibre-glass filler and some gelcoat.    The gelcoat is a bit thin and can scrape off from the epoxy in trapeze hook accidents, but the foam / epoxy bit remains untouched. Tough as boots I think.

.... and Vandercraft's phantom hulls are actually made by Ovington these days!

Whatever; any modern phant (and my local opponents are in vandercrafts) seem to have an unreasonably favourable handicap and despite an official PY of 1045 have been consigned by my club to the sub 1000 "fast" fleet!  Nice boats.
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Posts: 3958 		Post Options Post Options   Quote winging it Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 08 at 12:59pm
Why are you wearing a trapeze in a phantom? 
the same, but different...

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jeffers View Drop Down
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 08 at 11:15pm
We have several Vandercraft expoxy Phantoms at Hunts. There have been 2 issues with them:

1) Toes strap fixings coming away from the floor

2) Side decks giving due to wrong placement on frames under the decks (one guy has had 3 hulls, the third one was one of a new btach with the frames repositioned).

There were a number of QA issues with the original Vanedercraft boats (not the Ovi built ones) as the people who were making the hulls were not specialist boat builder they were more in to car bodywork which is not so critical as it was going over spaceframes etc..
Paul
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HannahJ View Drop Down
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Posts: 861 		Post Options Post Options   Quote HannahJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 08 at 7:38pm
Back on topic...

Had a pleasant drift around the lake with a forum member (will he show his face) this afternoon, did pretty well too, not that the visiting helm got a higher position than me, no, admitting nothing... very very shifty, the run ended up as nearly a beat but we kept the kite up! Also nice overtaking half the fleet by going up the inside... very satisfying after being pushed right back at the start.

Question: if we're port and another boat is starboard and calling on us to tack, we tack off and they tack simultaneously, even though there was no danger of collision (quite...) should we still have done our turn?


Edited by HannahJ
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Villan View Drop Down
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Posts: 1768 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Villan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 08 at 9:52pm
Originally posted by HannahJ

Back on topic...

Had a pleasant drift around the lake with a forum member (will he show his face) this afternoon, did pretty well too, not that the visiting helm got a higher position than me, no, admitting nothing...


Yes, He shall show his face ...

Teehee ... Best GP14 fleet in the area ... yeh yeh

(For those who dont know ... I helmed race 2 today ... and got 5th place (Out of 20-something boats) ... and thats the 2nd time I've sailed a GP14 .. First was one which was stern main and I only helmed for 2 mins ... spent the rest of the day crewing)
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HannahJ View Drop Down
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Posts: 861 		Post Options Post Options   Quote HannahJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 08 at 10:00pm
6th place, wasn't it... And it is, where else can you get a fleet of 30 boats on the start line every week throughout the year?
MIRROR 64799 "Dolphin"
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Villan View Drop Down
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Posts: 1768 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Villan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 08 at 10:01pm
5th .. 6th .... not that much difference :P

One more big header and we'd have had 2 of them!
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jun 08 at 10:29am
Originally posted by HannahJ

we tack off and they tack simultaneously, even though there was no danger of collision (quite...) should we still have done our turn?

Case 50 in the case book talks about this sort of incident, although in the case it was Starboard bearing away behind port not tacking.
A starboard-tack boat in such circumstances need not hold her course so as to prove, by hitting the port-tack boat, that a collision was inevitable. Moreover, if she does so she will break rule 14. At a protest hearing, S must establish either that contact would have occurred if she had held her course, or that there was enough doubt that P could safely cross ahead to create a reasonable apprehension of contact on S’s part and that it was unlikely that S would have ‘no need to take avoiding action’ (see the definition Keep Clear).

In her own defence, P must present adequate evidence to establish either that S did not change course or that P would have safely crossed ahead of S and that S had no need to take avoiding action. When, after considering all the evidence, a protest committee finds that S did not change course or that there was not a genuine and reasonable apprehension of collision on her part, it should dismiss her protest. When, however, it is satisfied that S did change course, that there was reasonable doubt that P could have crossed ahead, and that S was justified in taking avoiding action by
bearing away, then P should be disqualified.


I reckon you can handily substitute tacking for bearing away, and so if S had a "genuine and reasonable apprehension of collision" you should have done your turns. If you didn't you should retire (yes, even now!).

Edited by JimC
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