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Is inflation impacting Nationals Attendance?
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fab100 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 4:51pm
Originally posted by Paramedic

Originally posted by Mozzy



But even toward the social end of the fleet people often over egg the number of races they want... If you poll the fleet facebook group 5 months out from the event I would Imagine more races often getting more votes... but come the 4th races of a 20 knot day with a few recalls and breakages thrown in, then the attrition rate is stark, not just on the water but the knock on impact to the bar takings the same evening too!  

This is so true. The other point when you have a mix of competitors ranging from those who will sit in the boat park till 19:00 on the off chance of a race to those who after an hour want to build sandcastles/go to the eden project/lands end/etc etc its really hard to strike a balance.

The balance - in some ways unfortunately - has to be towards the family sailors as the the upper echelon will come to your nationals almost regardless if the racing is good. Put the families off and youll struggle to make 25 boats. In pretty much any fleet.

Don't bother going to Lands End, it's an over-priced, disappointing waste of a day out. Plenty of better things to do in Cornwall
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Paramedic View Drop Down
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Posts: 929 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Paramedic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 4:29pm
Originally posted by Mozzy



But even toward the social end of the fleet people often over egg the number of races they want... If you poll the fleet facebook group 5 months out from the event I would Imagine more races often getting more votes... but come the 4th races of a 20 knot day with a few recalls and breakages thrown in, then the attrition rate is stark, not just on the water but the knock on impact to the bar takings the same evening too!  

This is so true. The other point when you have a mix of competitors ranging from those who will sit in the boat park till 19:00 on the off chance of a race to those who after an hour want to build sandcastles/go to the eden project/lands end/etc etc its really hard to strike a balance.

The balance - in some ways unfortunately - has to be towards the family sailors as the the upper echelon will come to your nationals almost regardless if the racing is good. Put the families off and youll struggle to make 25 boats. In pretty much any fleet.


Edited by Paramedic - 12 Jul 22 at 4:31pm
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turnturtle View Drop Down
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 3:48pm
Originally posted by Mozzy

Originally posted by turnturtle

The conundrum of servicing the needs of those who might get in the Top 5 or 10 vs providing enough bang for buck to get the middle and end of the fleet to even show up, is nothing new.

Who knows, with foreign holidays and flights getting ever-so much more expensive, then perhaps a nationals event somewhere decent on UK coastline, tied into a wider family holiday, might not be done-for quite yet.

I just got back from Merlin Week. Bit of a deviation from the sailing I normally do, but also very fun. Different, but works well for the same reason that Fed week works well (or most regatta weeks for that matter). One race a day so plenty of time for family and very little time waiting between races.



sounds like a perfect compromise

I'm not in the UK these days, but I can't imagine the prospect of a conventional UK holiday would hold much appeal.  I'd honestly rather stay at home given there was nothing wrong with my gaff.

Chuck a bit sailing/windsurfing/paddleboarding into the mix, guaranteed - not just 'promised', then the calculus changes.... but too much sailing, then it's not really fair on the rest of the family either.


Edited by turnturtle - 12 Jul 22 at 3:48pm
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Posts: 205 		Post Options Post Options   Quote sawman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 3:28pm
Originally posted by Mozzy

Originally posted by turnturtle

The conundrum of servicing the needs of those who might get in the Top 5 or 10 vs providing enough bang for buck to get the middle and end of the fleet to even show up, is nothing new.

Who knows, with foreign holidays and flights getting ever-so much more expensive, then perhaps a nationals event somewhere decent on UK coastline, tied into a wider family holiday, might not be done-for quite yet.

I just got back from Merlin Week. Bit of a deviation from the sailing I normally do, but also very fun. Different, but works well for the same reason that Fed week works well (or most regatta weeks for that matter). One race a day so plenty of time for family and very little time waiting between races.



this sort of family friendly format definitely has some legs. My club recently held a regatta week, with 1st race in the evening, so that you didn't have to take the day off to go sailing, but equally this would allow good family time and combine an enjoyable regatta.

the last national champs I did was a windy week at Hunstanton (great club, and decent race management) the vagaries of the british summer was that the 1st 2 days were spent looking at the waves from the prom - non sailing family off on their own all day, and then sailing family either too knackered to move or stuck at the necessary but rather dull class AGM or some other social event in the evening. Then on the last night enduring the seemingly never ending trophy presentations before slogging back up north for 5 hours home. Difficult to sell a nationals to the household again. 
Great class, lovely people but class nationals are not the way to spend your only family holiday in the year. 

probably a different story for the unhindered 20 something though!!
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Posts: 209 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 2:27pm
Originally posted by turnturtle

The conundrum of servicing the needs of those who might get in the Top 5 or 10 vs providing enough bang for buck to get the middle and end of the fleet to even show up, is nothing new.

Who knows, with foreign holidays and flights getting ever-so much more expensive, then perhaps a nationals event somewhere decent on UK coastline, tied into a wider family holiday, might not be done-for quite yet.

For better or worse the events tend to be driven by those who are more concerned with the racing than the social. For 50% of attendees I would imagine the racing is more a way to tie in a common interest and as good talking point for the bar as it is a pure text of their sailing prowess. 

But even toward the social end of the fleet people often over egg the number of races they want... If you poll the fleet facebook group 5 months out from the event I would Imagine more races often getting more votes... but come the 4th races of a 20 knot day with a few recalls and breakages thrown in, then the attrition rate is stark, not just on the water but the knock on impact to the bar takings the same evening too!  
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Posts: 209 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 2:20pm
Originally posted by turnturtle

The conundrum of servicing the needs of those who might get in the Top 5 or 10 vs providing enough bang for buck to get the middle and end of the fleet to even show up, is nothing new.

Who knows, with foreign holidays and flights getting ever-so much more expensive, then perhaps a nationals event somewhere decent on UK coastline, tied into a wider family holiday, might not be done-for quite yet.

I just got back from Merlin Week. Bit of a deviation from the sailing I normally do, but also very fun. Different, but works well for the same reason that Fed week works well (or most regatta weeks for that matter). One race a day so plenty of time for family and very little time waiting between races.
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Posts: 209 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Mozzy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 2:12pm
Originally posted by NickA

110 entries though. Not many adult classes can match that.

If only all those topper squad kids sailes on into adulthood. The whole zone squad, national squad thing seems designed to filter most people out the system in favour of a few Olympic hopefuls..;£#££

Zones squads are no more, and I think even national squads have been stripped back at junior (under 16s). This was a pre-covid change but I am not sure how long the results of this change will take to filter through, but I would expect to see less sailors at national junior events as a result (zone squad sailors used to be strongly encouraged to go to the nationals). Hopefully the drop in numbers are because more are spending more time in their regions travelling less and sailing more. 

There are similar signs of drops in RS Tera, Feva and Optimist, but it's hard to separate out from covid impacts, venue selection and now inflation. 

"RTGs were introduced to address challenges facing the sport including declining participation at club level, increasing regional disparity, an over-emphasis on results in junior age groups and the increasing costs and environmental impact of training and racing nationally at a young age."
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 1:22pm
The conundrum of servicing the needs of those who might get in the Top 5 or 10 vs providing enough bang for buck to get the middle and end of the fleet to even show up, is nothing new.

Who knows, with foreign holidays and flights getting ever-so much more expensive, then perhaps a nationals event somewhere decent on UK coastline, tied into a wider family holiday, might not be done-for quite yet.


Edited by turnturtle - 12 Jul 22 at 1:23pm
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The Q View Drop Down
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Posts: 126 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The Q Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 1:15pm
I'm Afraid I agree with you, I found big water sailing very boring, that's why I now race on the rivers of the  Norfolk Broads. 
River banks to miss, boats from other classes coming back the other way, unqualified tourists in motor boats to avoid, and that's just round the cans outside the club. Add to that  the odd sail down river to a pub have lunch and sail back and it makes for a much more interesting sail..
Regatta week in two weeks and a bit time, I'm looking forward to 7 days sailing and a function at the club every night. Here's a link to last years regatta,
https://www.yachtsandyachting.com/news/240486/Horning-Sailing-Club-Regatta-Week-2021#:~:text=Horning%20Sailing%20Club's%20Regatta%20Week,two%20days%20of%20contrasting%20conditions
It's an open event the Monday to Friday....
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Posts: 353 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Riv Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 22 at 12:28pm
I've only done one nationals a long time ago.
Torbay, sloshing up and down, light winds, on the
water for ages
God! It was the dullest way of spending a week.
Before COVID I was mooching around Torquay and came
across the Laser 2000s. Light winds, they sailed out, I
watched the race and it turned into a procession. I was
bored watching it.
I think from my limited experience that the Nationals of
any class that want that style of open water big course sailing
will only ever have a limited attraction to most sailors.
I fully expect most of it to die out and be replaced by
more sociable and entertaining formats
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