Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Tower trapezing |
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Sam.Spoons ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3401 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 10 Mar 20 at 10:40pm |
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That's bad enough when trapezeing 'normally'
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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish" |
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Sam.Spoons ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3401 |
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It isn't a sport at all, at least not from any definition of 'sport' I have ever heard ![]()
The attraction of the Olympics is in the variety and diversity of sporting endeavour on display, reducing it all to a spectacle is missing the point (yes, ok, I know that's what to was when the Greeks and Romans were doing it but.....). There are plenty os 'spectacle sports' available without destroying the principles of Olympic competition.
Edited by Sam.Spoons - 10 Mar 20 at 10:35pm |
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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish" |
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423zero ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 08 Jan 15 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3420 |
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I keep picturing the boat flat out, then runs aground, not sure I would want to see it.
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Robert
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Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Hmmm professional wrestling has great viewing figures, but isn't an Olympic sport. The 100m is one of the major events of the games, and is simple in the extreme. Not sure gimmicks make an Olympic sport, but simple, human endeavour and greatness.
For me, the great sports are those with history. The athletics don't chop and change, saying that the 100m is out of date. Stick with some classic events where history shines through. |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Riv ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 23 Nov 13 Location: South Devon Online Status: Offline Posts: 353 |
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The initial reason for the post was the creation of a spectacle. I've been thinking about what Sport means, and concluded that Sporting activities that are televised for the mass market are now not sport but branches of the entertainment industry. Considering only the top level of Sailing Entertainment that is the Olympics and the need to drive views/clicks/hits to profit from it; then why not allow extreme sporting aspects such as tower trapezing only at the top level? Falls will be more interesting and frequent. Kiting is in the Olympics why should not dinghy sailing at the elite professional level not follow suit in creating a risk based spectacle? Should not elite professional Olympic dinghy sailing demand the consistent demonstration of the highest physical skills as in Olympic gymnastics?
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Mistral Div II prototype board, Original Windsurfer, Hornet built'74.
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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I can see a number of places where there could be significant improvements. Aerodynamic drag is generally pretty awful, there are gains to be made there. Further developments is more gust responsive rigs could make it practical to run bigger rigs with little penalty, and I'm sure there are benefits in hull shape. And whenever new materials come along there's a benefit as things that were impractical become practical. Carbon fibre masts are made out of what was unobtanium in the 1960s... Also, TBH, none of the current crop of performance singlehanders strike me as exceptional boats.
The biggest reason why I don't see any major developments in the short term is simply that high performance boats are out of fashion. |
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Sam.Spoons ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3401 |
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Just seen a video advertising the 2020 Waszp nationals, looks a bit like racing short board windsurfers, only the more talented sailors can actually make them go and they have a very narrow wind range. Brilliant if you can sail it and if the wind plays ball, desperately frustrating if not.
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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish" |
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Dougaldog ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 05 Nov 10 Location: hamble Online Status: Offline Posts: 356 |
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Rupert, How right you are! The early Mk 1 Rondars could be a pig and if you really had an early one, with the x-profile traveller track running right across the cockpit, then you will still be carrying the scars to today! Yet the Contender was a game changer, then in quite quick succession you had the 600, then the 700/MPS - each changed the game in it's own way. But the important thing in all of this - as I stressed in the talk, was that these superb boats represented something of a step function. So yes, you could tweak the MPS or, as I alluded to, come up with something even more extreme, but the reality of the sport today is that further step functions just aren't there anymore (unless you subscribe to the I-GRF belief in building boats from exotic materials such as floatarium).The proof comes from the International Moths who went down this route, as boats got ever more extreme (I was there when Ian Ridge made a hull out of the remains of a Unicorn hull) and in a recent thread elsewhere, it was widely accepted that these super-skinny lowriders, with an alloy rig, were the hardest of all the dinghies to sail....but as you pointed out, people did master them eventually. However, without suspending the laws of nature, I can't see where anything else is going to come from! Dougal
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Dougal H
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Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Dougal, people said that the Contender was as hard as singlehanded sailing could get, and that the 600 and Musto were unavailable. All it too ("all", he says) was a development of new techniques and a willingness to share them through the fleet. This has shortened the learning curve to a point where talented sailors can learn, as well as the superstars.
So, somewhere out there is the next step, the next "impossible" boat to give the next jump in performance. Excluding foils, of course. Personally, I like a boat under me, so I'll carry on in my archaic bubble! |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Dougaldog ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 05 Nov 10 Location: hamble Online Status: Offline Posts: 356 |
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Riv (as original poster)…..this was pretty much the 'meat' in my topic at the Dinghy Show, when I was discussing the development of the performance single hander. The conclusion was a question - in boats such as the Musto Skiff, have single handers reached a final plateau of development. You can't add in any more sail, because there is not a lot more in the way of righting moment to be had. Way back in the day, Elvstrom did try a single hander that had a massively long plank, but very quickly binned the idea as 'unsailable'. There was talk a couple of years ago of a boat based on the B14 hull that would have wide racks... I don't think it went very far and I can't say if it used the trapeze as well, but the physics suggest against it, As you move further outboard from the centreline, the angle subtended between the trapeze wire and the mast increases, with being out on the wire becoming ever more difficult. Right back in the early days, the Coronet (which begat the 5o5) had a trapeze, but with the take off for the wires being at spreader height, which simply didn't work. In the famous Round the Island dinghy race, Coronet lost out big time to Osprey, which had the trapeze wires taken up to the hounds and John Westell, who was crewing on Coronet, had to watch at the ease with which Cliff Norbury on Osprey could trapeze and tack as they slogged along the beat from St. Cats Point to Sandown. So back to that all important question - could you make an even more extreme single handed boat.... yes of course, but who would actually be able to sail such a boat? Why look at a boat that is only applicable to a small number of super elite sailors, when boats like the IC and MPS offer peak performance today as part of an established international circuit! Dougal
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Dougal H
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