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A new class of dinghy?
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RossV View Drop Down
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    Posted: 07 Oct 18 at 8:54am
Originally posted by ttc546


Originally posted by 423zero

What we need is a new self assembly boat, easier to do than the Mirror, no stitch and tape, similar to the Dinosaur wooden model kits, national advertising campaign, get schools and sailing clubs involved, 'Mirror group' type thing.
One of our older members said when the Mirror started they were a 'Bloody nuisance' sailing anywhere and everywhere, much like open water swimmers today.

Today, people want an instant fix to their activity needs, and building a boat from a kit, however laudable and popular it was in the past (and I count myself in that group), it is unlikely to appeal to todays generation. Sadly.
TTC546 I think the answer to you is yes and no. Sailing has always had the "blast the details, I'd rather be on the water! Crowd." It has also had many, probably more than it's share, of deep thinkers and practical people. The heavy emphasis on SMODs has worked against that latter group.

Today, there is a powerful focus on getting young people "launched" into adult life. Sailing and boatbuilding is a chance to make a statement about yourself right on your naiscent CV - "I have practical skills and can see a project through to completion." We can't all be elite athletes - another nice way of enhancing your chances of selection, but boat building is a powerful message. A message that the sport needs to use to slow it's decline.
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I was involved in a project by King Alfred School in North London where the pupils built three Nigel Irens 17ft strip plank expedition boats, which they subsequently used on Scottish “Raids”; I think the children must have gained lots of life skills.  Perhaps a school CDT program is suited to this since it is timetabled into the kids lives.
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423zero View Drop Down
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 18 at 1:11pm
Kids today spend hours assembling Lego kits and days on some of the 3D puzzles, I think we are being to dismissive of the kids of today, after all when I was younger their were mates of mine who couldn't fix a puncture on their bikes, they couldn't remove the wheel.

Plywood patterns, Sail similar to brightly coloured sail on Photoshopped Laser on another thread, unstayed 2 piece mast, no Jib. Surely it's not beyond the skill of designers to design a kit that is prefinished only requiring assembly.

Perhaps offer design to Mirror class association, Mirror MK3, or a new class.


Edited by 423zero - 07 Oct 18 at 3:20pm
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RossV View Drop Down
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Posts: 16 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RossV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 18 at 6:07pm
423Zero - With relatively small sails unique colours within the class make it far easier to see what is going on at a distance and thus watching is more enjoyable. It certainly helps with the Firebugs in my club.

I note your preference for unstayed rigs but my experience with the Firebugs (with their sails on halyards and sometimes reefed) is that, on windy days, they are easier to rig and manoeuvre on their trolleys than boats like Optis which have their sails up all the time. It also eliminates failures within the mast step tube which occur in Lasers and Spirals. That is a tricky repair.

Many dinghy class in Sydney used to decorate their sails with huge symbols to aid identification. I surmise that this started as an aid to gambling on the 18s before the war but spread to smaller classes like the Vaucluse Juniors (AKA "VJs"). Gambling aside, it makes the sport more appealing to outsiders. I choose to have a couple of dark blue panels at the foot of my sail and my cataracts have got no worse since I made that decision. I attribute this to the greatly reduced reflection of sunlight into my eyes. It may not be a problem in the UK.
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423zero View Drop Down
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 18 at 6:07am
Unstayed Masts would make a simpler build, cheaper too, no need for stays and associated ironwork.
I tend to go for unstayed Masts due to the fact we have indoor storage.
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 18 at 10:28am
What about the Kirby Torch?
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RossV View Drop Down
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Posts: 16 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RossV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 18 at 11:19am
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

What about the Kirby Torch?


Please correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the Kirby Torch functionally the almost 50 year old Laser design? Unquestionably the Laser has greatly influenced modern sailing and pioneered the SMOD business model but is the past also the future?
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 18 at 11:22am
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

What about the Kirby Torch?


Yes what about the Kirby Torch what happened to it/them?

If ever a brilliant opportunity exists to re launch the modern Laser the way folk would be keener to have it, there it is. More vertical rudder pintles, better foils, better rig, carbon, carbon and more carbon, laminate sail, round the damned stern quarter, shorten the boom a tad and marginally raise the sail aspect ratio..

Why even I might consider one.

Edited by iGRF - 08 Oct 18 at 11:23am
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RossV View Drop Down
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Posts: 16 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RossV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 18 at 11:34am
Originally posted by 423zero

Unstayed Masts would make a simpler build, cheaper too, no need for stays and associated ironwork.
I tend to go for unstayed Masts due to the fact we have indoor storage.
Having spent much of the (southern) winter repairing mast step tube failures, hull failures under said mast step tubes and related breakages in my club's training fleet, I can't agree with you relating to construction let alone repair.

My club provides affordable (read cheap) sailing lessons to a middle bracket community in Sydney. The core of the training fleet are Spirals. They are very similar to Lasers...

Spiral dinghy on Wikipedia

To reduce the maintenance burden we are now looking at building a FRP sheathed wooden design to compliment our similarly sheathed Firebugs. Far easier to patch and paint than fading polyester mouldings. The consensus seems to be forming behind a 12 ft version of Keith Callaghan's Hadron H1.
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 18 at 2:00pm
Originally posted by RossV

Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

What about the Kirby Torch?


Please correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the Kirby Torch functionally the almost 50 year old Laser design? Unquestionably the Laser has greatly influenced modern sailing and pioneered the SMOD business model but is the past also the future?

The Kirby Torch was Bruce Kirby's failed attempt to reclaim the Laser design he sold for 2.6 million back in 2008. I don't know what his train of thought was but the court gave him pretty short shrift when they threw the case out in 2016. 

I apologise for not adding a smilie at the end of my post  Wink
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