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A new class of dinghy?
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Posts: 8956 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: A new class of dinghy?
    Posted: 27 Sep 18 at 8:33pm
Kicking a football against a wall is easy, but it doesn't mean you can play the game competitively, does it? Being able to stand up on a SUP doesn't mean you could compete in say, a Hawaiian downwind race. Making a Laser Funboat go back and forth doesn't mean you could enter the round Sheppey race. Every sport has an entry level, and I've done many 2 hour taster sessions in sailing, and a fair few in SUP. Never taught football, but I suspect you build skills, just as in any other sport.

Nice to read the usual sh*t about sailing instructors and schools. Wasn't like that in our day, eh? We were shoved out in a boat wearing nothing but shorts in a force 6 in November and it never did us any harm. Kids today, sailing these plastic Fusions and Hartley 15s. Old wooden crates rescued from the bonfire were good enough for us, made us real men.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 18 at 8:34pm
Sorry but, yes it is a start, a start to understanding how the wind in sail makes the boat go, then it's a small step to making ig go where you want it to (and learning where it won't go). I'm not suggesting a watchful eye is not required (and it was back in the day) but kids these days often have no chance to experience that freedom (to get things wrong too). 

The swimming story you mean is"I learned to swim when my dad threw me in and kept a close eye on me in case I struggled too much......"

Overprotective parents = pampered kids + safer )maybe) but frustrated and resentful kids.......
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JimC View Drop Down
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 5:23am
Maybe, but when we were shoved out in boats on our own we also learned all sorts of bad habits, some of which I for one still suffer from. The biggest problem I have with sailboat training as its run these days is that we don't really have the discipline of frequent check rides with an instructor to make sure we aren't developing bad habits or unhelpful techniques.
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turnturtle View Drop Down
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 5:49am
I think you do as kids, but I’d agree not as adults. One of the best sails of my life was when a now multiple Olympic medalist and AC team lead jumped in the back of my 420 when coaching us at winter training... it really was another level of boat handling, sail control and alll round expertise ... it wasn’t even ‘his class’ or one he’d spent much time in back then either.

I guess that level of training is available, but how many adults find the time And money to Make it happen?
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turnturtle View Drop Down
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 5:56am
Originally posted by PeterG

I'm waiting for an SDP. Why do you have to stand up - what's wrong with sitting down. Can you fit a chair to an SUP?  Smile


Yes you can - it converts them into a row boat kinda thing
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turnturtle View Drop Down
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 6:10am
Originally posted by davidyacht


Beats sitting on a beach


Precisely - and I defy anyone who has a genuine interest in watersports not to see the appeal of a glassy day in 3ft swell somewhere like Saunton Sands or Croyde beach. Given these are conditions that you can neither sail dinghies, nor wind or kite surf in. Not without a healthy RNLI donation to follow.

Take a 10’5 out, catch some waves - far earlier than you would prone surfing ... fall in quite a bit too. It’s great fun and ‘20 yards on flat water write off’ scarcely representative of the world that has just been opened up for you.

Personally I wasn’t interested in flat water SUP for years, this has come later - and it’s more akin to road biking for pleasurable exercise for me and the guys and girls I do it with on local rivers and the odd lake.

Edited by turnturtle - 28 Sep 18 at 6:13am
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423zero View Drop Down
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 6:23am
There are a couple of sailors at my club who will coach for free, all first class sailors, our SI did the Whitbread a few times (when it was the Whitbread).
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davidyacht View Drop Down
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Posts: 1345 		Post Options Post Options   Quote davidyacht Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 7:13am
Originally posted by JimC

Maybe, but when we were shoved out in boats on our own we also learned all sorts of bad habits, some of which I for one still suffer from. The biggest problem I have with sailboat training as its run these days is that we don't really have the discipline of frequent check rides with an instructor to make sure we aren't developing bad habits or unhelpful techniques.

I continue to race five sailors who first started sailing at the same time as me, in the early seventies, all of them have stuck with the sport for 45 years.  All of them had minimal coaching except of the fundamentals, and none of them had any parental involvement except perhaps the purchase of their first boat, mainly of the “drop off at the sailing club gates” variety.

Today I see that the really good youngsters working through the club have a real passion for messing about in boats and have had little exposure to national squads, mainly because we are too remote, but several have now achieved top six places at major championships.

My conclusion from this is that any type of training of youngsters requires a soft touch to encourage a lifetime interest in the sport.

Another thought is that in many other sports ... golf and skiing spring to mind, as an experienced participant I can gain access to a coach at the local school to improve my game; in dinghy sailing this is far more problematic ... and is usually resolved by reading books rather than shipping a coach in.

It is also true that the bigger improvements in my game were the result of being in the front end of the boat with better sailors than I at the back ... with the demise of the double handler this will prove increasingly difficult to recreate.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 8:47am
That pretty much nails it as I see it @davidyacht, well said  Thumbs Up (FWIW I learned in the late '60s but my dad was a keen dinghy sailor).

WRT SUP, @turnturtle also well said. Where I sail we don't get 3' swells on glassy days, only when it's blowing old boots so I would be denied that undoubted pleasure but I may come to flat water SUPping later.
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jeffers View Drop Down
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 18 at 8:52am
Originally posted by JimC

Maybe, but when we were shoved out in boats on our own we also learned all sorts of bad habits, some of which I for one still suffer from. The biggest problem I have with sailboat training as its run these days is that we don't really have the discipline of frequent check rides with an instructor to make sure we aren't developing bad habits or unhelpful techniques.

The problem with that Jim is that the RYA method whilst a good starting point does not work for everyone (certainly doesn't for me) but i still teach it as per the book then when they get to the level of coaching they are encouraged to experiment a little. For some the method works fine, for others it doesn't.

What is more in need of addressing is hiking posture and at an early stage especially with kids.
Paul
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