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How windy is too windy
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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    Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 9:26am
Just found this :-

112 vs. 999

Over the years I’ve heard quite a few amusing myths about the 112 service, such as:

    • “You get a better response”:

No you don’t. 112 and 999 use exactly the same emergency call centre. The emergency operator probably doesn’t even know which number you dialled.

    • “Your location can be pinpointed”:

Not really, and not routinely. And even if it were, it would only provide an approximate location. If a phone signal is picked up by a network transmitter, it must be in the area covered by that transmitter. If a phone signal is picked up by two or more transmitters, it must be in the area that is covered by all of those transmitters. In a major city this area could be a few hundred square yards (perhaps the size of Trafalgar Square – and imagine trying to find someone in Trafalgar Square); elsewhere it might be a few square miles.

    • “It will use a satellite if there is no phone signal”:

Come on, think about it. The signal from your phone is barely strong enough to reach a transmitter more than a few miles away – it’s hardly going to be able to communicate with a satellite a few hundred miles away.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 10:04am
Originally posted by JimC

 Maybe so, but if you managed to get yourself Schumachered and your family were faced with the prospect of 40 years of care bills I doubt you being horrified would be an awfully big factor in their deliberations. Read about Ridd versus RYA.

I did read what had been posted, somewhere else in the forum. It sounds tragic. There are some specific to the case which make it different in my view. Firstly it involved a child. Secondly the RYA held information about the safety of the boat that competitors did not. 

I said up thread that I know the health and safety laws don't work the way I'd like them too, but this case doesn't change my opinion that adults racing in their own boat and kit, with the best knowledge of their own ability, are best placed to assess and accept risk. 

So yeah. I wish RO would make calls on fairness of racing, and competitors decides if they are safe.

I think upper and lower limits are useful in class rules. Sure, without a measurement standard then they're quite a soft rule, but they do give you an idea of whats expected at class events, and therefore what to train for. They also give the RO an idea of what the class considers fair, so they can deliver accordingly.

 
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RS400atC View Drop Down
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Posts: 3011 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 10:14am
A cell phone's location can be narrowed down a lot by the network.
A phone is typically in contact with several basestations at any time. Each will have range from the time delay. Typically the networks can place a phone in a box better than 50m square.
Sailing off the coast of course, it's more likely the phone might only have on base station in view, so only range and sector might be available. A typical remote area basestation might have 4 sectors so the network would know if the phone was N/E/S/W of the station, possibly better than that due to the sectors overlapping.
GPS enabled phones will use A-GPS to give a quick fix in an emergency call.
Phones will generally roam to any network for 999/112 but they do need a SIM in them.
They also need to be compatible with the network, i.e. cover the band. A 2G throwaway phone isn't going to roam to a 4g-only base station etc.

Things have moved on somewhat from very early days when all 999 calls on vodafone appeared to happen in Newbury, where their 'big switch' was.
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423zero View Drop Down
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 10:41am
Sam,
Can only quote info given to me 5 weeks ago on our 3 year RYA first aid top up.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 10:42am
All we need now is a smartphone that can cope with regular dunkings in seawater  Embarrassed
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Posts: 3011 		Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 10:48am
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

All we need now is a smartphone that can cope with regular dunkings in seawater  Embarrassed

They are about at a price.
A basic pocket telephone which works on all the bands and can actually be used in one of those Aquapac things might be an option.
I get reasonable coverage using a '£20 from Argos' 2G Nokia, YMMV.
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Posts: 3420 		Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 11:59am
On my second one this year, sometimes they are ok, dunked one about 6 times before it finally succumbed.
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 1:08pm
Actually I have an old iPhone 5S which I intend to use for RaceQs in a Decathlon waterproof pouch (which I have tested with my waterproof GPS).
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 1:09pm
Originally posted by blueboy

Originally posted by jeffers

Personally, I feel responsible for my own decision when I go sailing. If I don't like the conditions I turn round and go back ashore.

You can't necessarily do that. For example if you sail out to Hayling Bay on a building ebb in a strong S/SW, you'd have a very exciting time returning before the ebb slackens due to the large and sometimes breaking waves that build in the entrance. Local clubs will time racing with exactly that in mind, to get sailors back in after 2 races when the waves in the entrance have flattened. Capsizes when attempting to come home with the ebb still running in 20/25 knots are liable to be mast breaking experiences.   

And were that my local water I would know that. Were I a racing visitor I would expect advice from the club/organisers. 

Were I a casual visitor intending to do sailing I would do my homework.

At the end of the day the decision to go would be mine, if I couldn't get back then it would be a long wait or gaining assistance to get back. I certainly wouldn't be holding the club or organiser responsible for my choice to go afloat as long as they have provided the appropriate information.
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Sep 18 at 1:38pm
How often does one need to make the point that its not necessarily going to be you holding the club or organiser responsible? Widows, parents, carers, insurance companies, all of these are liable to sue if something goes badly wrong. If a court says there's a responsibility it doesn't matter one tiny bit if any of us think there ought not to be.
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