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When is a class dead?
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H2 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 1:55pm
I am a bit confused by the argument that says that if you get rid of the "dead classes" that it will solve the problems and stop the decline of the sport. Most clubs I have been at have one or two strong classes and a strong handicap fleet made up of a totally random selection of boats. If you fit into one of the larger classes (budget, sailing style and body size/weight) then I guess most people opt for that but in most clubs there is always a large and happy bunch of people who want to choose a boat that is not a solo and sail that. By killing off that choice I think you would accelerate sailing demise!
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Posts: 2538 		Post Options Post Options   Quote turnturtle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 2:03pm
Originally posted by Old Timer

Originally posted by turnturtle

Originally posted by Old Timer

Well there are plenty of classes that show little signs of life. 



as Jim says, a list would be handy.... 

I am sure we can all see the classes that are inactive ...

My point is that if the dead wood could be cleared perhaps the rest would flourish ...

I would agree we could all write a prejudiced list of classes that we may no longer interact with - but 'dead', or just going through a bad patch.... I'd say we're getting it right and letting the market decide, rather than expecting the RYA to bull doze in on this one.  
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Posts: 356 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Dougaldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 2:16pm
At the risk of seeing an otherwise interesting thread hijacked into a "what have the Romans, sorry, RYA, done for us" debate, I do fear that some of the comments made above about a cull of older, smaller, less active classes (and maybe clubs too) isn't a million miles from where the RYA mindset now resides. If it hasn't got an association with the following short list of words; elite, champion, youth, Olympic, squad, foiling and TV friendly.....then they could actually live without it and would love to only have to run a slimmed down and elitist group sailing a small number of classes.

This is not just a case of a few choice words said in jest, for I see example after example of a growing gulf opening up between the highly managed elite side of the sport and an almost 'leave them to their own devices' hands off approach to the growing number who sail outside of organized race activity. When I look at the RYA now, I get an uncomfortable feeling of the days of dear old DR. Beeching, looking at the railways. Complex, scattered right across the country, 80% of the revenue came from 20% of the network. So cull the ineffective 80% and move on.

The last couple of weeks I've been getting about a bit (I even risked heading into Kent, but the sage of the South East was absent) and I now have people coming up to me at sailing clubs, telling me pretty much the local version of the above, which suggests that the thinking is not that far off course. The big problem however is that many of these ills are, I fear, a disease of the UK; go abroad at the dynamics can be very different!

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Posts: 715 		Post Options Post Options   Quote transient Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 2:26pm
Originally posted by Old Timer


My point is that if the dead wood could be cleared perhaps the rest would flourish ...


Not quite sure how that could be achieved without a very high level of dictatorial insensitivity, do this or else type thing. Many wouldn't want to be part of a sport that operated in that manner.
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Posts: 1005 		Post Options Post Options   Quote fab100 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 3:21pm
Originally posted by Dougaldog

If it hasn't got an association with the following short list of words; elite, champion, youth, Olympic, squad, foiling and TV friendly...
or alternatively, if it HAS got an association with the following short list of words; elite, champion, youth, Olympic, squad or TV friendly, I'd happily see it culled (foiling, I might let live).

We might then fail to put off so many.

But all Skippers, Laser 13s and Laser 16s need to go on the pyre regardless. It would be a kindness to the deluded who might be otherwise tempted
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Posts: 6662 		Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 3:29pm
Originally posted by Old Timer

I am sure we can all see the classes that are inactive ...
My point is that if the dead wood could be cleared perhaps the rest would flourish ...

Frankly I have no idea what you are classing as dead wood. If you mean classes that maybe manage half a dozen races in the PY return list or less every year from maybe one or two boats, then the amount of dead wood they represent is nearly nothing, and banning them would make next to no difference to anything.

If on the other hand you mean classes that get less than 30 boats at a Nationals that's, well...
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Posts: 245 		Post Options Post Options   Quote KazRob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 3:51pm
That's where it gets personal and subjective Jim. I don't think you would say the canoes are a dead class (and neither would I ) but looking at the report to Y&Y from Weymouth I only count 28 boats. Likewise can a class be dead if it only gets a few boats at the nats or even no nats but still has a big following in nearby countries - thinking of the Europe here.
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Posts: 370 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Old Timer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 3:55pm
Originally posted by transient

Originally posted by Old Timer


My point is that if the dead wood could be cleared perhaps the rest would flourish ...


Not quite sure how that could be achieved without a very high level of dictatorial insensitivity, do this or else type thing. Many wouldn't want to be part of a sport that operated in that manner.



Perhaps the RYA could do it in a more positive way.

Maybe we have too many champions.

Perhaps if the RYA said it was going to recognise champions in the following categories:

- Single hander (hiking) 
- Single hander (trapeze)
- Double hander (hiking) 
- Double hander (trapeze)

Have a lightweight and heavyweight category in each section ... then nominate the equipment ...

That may shift more attention to the RYA adopted adult classes ....
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Posts: 750 		Post Options Post Options   Quote H2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 4:16pm
What the hell has the RYA got to do with this? If we have interesting boats and friendly clubs then we will see more people out there. Our little pond at South Cerney had ten boats out for a pursuit race this last Saturday (including Albacore, Solo, Laser, Vareo, Hadron, Topper) plus ten cadets out training, five 420s out with people learning to sail and a handful of others pottering about. Thirty boats out on a small pond at the end of September and I doubt anyone mentioned the RYA at any point!!
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Old Timer View Drop Down
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Posts: 370 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Old Timer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 17 at 4:20pm
Originally posted by H2

What the hell has the RYA got to do with this?

err... well they are the governing body for our sport ... 
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