Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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RS aero |
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rich96 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 20 Jan 05 Online Status: Offline Posts: 596 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 13 Feb 15 at 9:22am |
The lightweight laser sails needed to be changed for major events (regardless of what is/was claimed). They were hopeless in that regard.
Even club sailors looked at at least annual upgrades if you sailed regularly. Dacron sails on stayed masts (Contender and lots of other two man boats) can remain competitive for a good while. They also can on an OK - unstayed rig. So if the Aero sails and rig generally are up to the sort of technical level of an Ok rig they may be fine - if they are mass produced like the Laser there may be issues. Time will tell ? Dacron must still be the way to go for 'holiday company' boats ? My only point is not about the quality, lifetime, efficiency etc of the rig - its just its visual perception (to me). When I see the Aero next to the Zero I see 'quality, high tech etc' versus 'fun boat' - I totally accept that that is unfair perhaps but that just the perception. When the Laser came out it looked modern racy and a step up from anything else around. Of course that's hard to do now with so many boats about. Buyers of the Aero will no doubt think, and know, that the boats are great - which I'm sure they are. |
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turnturtle ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 05 Dec 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2538 |
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I think the Laser is a very good analogy for this case in point - nearly every aspect of the concept has been modelled on a 21st Century Laser principles- even down to mirroring the 4.7, Radial and Standard rig with like for like Aero sals.
It's too early to judge the competitive life of an Aero dacron sail, and secondly without knowing the price of a replacement sail, without the associated lower mast section, it's hard to even have a stab at the running cost either. (An additional rig is £840 - but this includes a lump of carbon tubing). As for mylar, I'd personally expect 2-3 seasons for average club use if it's been well maintained, but some show significant longer lives with light usage- my original RS300 sail was in excellent condition despite being about 8 years old.
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Do Different ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 26 Jan 12 Location: North Online Status: Offline Posts: 1312 |
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As said the Dacron vs Laminate has been done to death and I am not qualified to comment.
BUT. Come on people keep it real. What I do know is citing the Laser as an example of a short lived Dacron sail is not comparing like with like. We all know that due to the requirements of making a stiff (and in my view horrible) mast bend to set the best shape ridiculously high loads are applied to the sail controls. Of course ripping the cunningham eye down past the gooseneck will result in a short life. Hopefully a mast with some level of calculated bend will be much kinder to it's sail and it's sailors. |
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jeffers ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 29 Mar 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3048 |
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A Laser sail has a very short competitive life and the performance drop off is noticable. If you are going to compete on the open circuit you will likely go through 2 maybe 3 sails a season. but that is another thread completely....
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Paul
---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
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turnturtle ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 05 Dec 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2538 |
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I'm sure that could well be what you've been told, but in my opinion the Dacron used on an Aero sail will have a far shorter competitive life than say the Mylar on an RS300, or an ODL06 Mylar Phantom sail. That is certainly my experience with Dacron Laser sails. |
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Each manufacturer has made a choice. I guess RS have followed a 3 rig route to make it as wide as possible. The Zero has a rig designed for the boat . i.e boat was designed and the rig with it. The smaller rig has now been designed to suit smaller sailors. Whether that extends down to smaller youths don't know.
Neither is right or wrong it's just how it's evolved. The supernova had an 8 m battened sail and I found that about spot on for my size and sailing area. Obviously it's a stayed rig, so we will see how things work out with a more gust responsive carbon rig.
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Eminoxon ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 12 Jun 13 Location: Bicester Online Status: Offline Posts: 32 |
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i dont see whats so bad about dacron, lasers are dacron. they have a much longer life too. unimpressed with the feva mylar sail, had to be repaired quite quickly at the clew. dacron is easier to read the wind in ligt stuff. te old 200 sail is heavy duty and i think probably better quality than whatever they are going to replace it with.
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Newtothis
RS feva 4624, share Rs200 1317, daughters RS tera 798 rs aero 1301 |
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turnturtle ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 05 Dec 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2538 |
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True - except the zero covers a broader range with two rigs whereas the aero needs 3.... And from a marketing perspective I'm not sure that's a bad thing btw... #notjustforkids
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The rig works extremely well and if people think its a 'beach rig' well thats fine. It generates a great deal of curve in the mast and in that respect looks not unlike a finn or even a windsurf sail.
Supernova's (which I still love by the way) Solos and plenty of other boats have what you might all consider more "serious rigs", but they are neither as fast nor necessarily as good to sail. At the end of the day its what the rig does that matters and the aero rig works well. IF you look at the two 'ero rigs they are in some ways the same - all carbon and unstayed and yet in other ways very different - 'serious' = mylar and 'beach boat - (apparently) = Dacron. But guess what - there doesn't really appear to be a gnats whisker between them in overall performance. So it doesn't really matter what one person or another's perception is, nor that the cuts, sail cloth and mast characteristics are different, because they both do the job very well in a nice simple package.
Edited by SimonW99 - 12 Feb 15 at 5:47pm |
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turnturtle ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 05 Dec 14 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2538 |
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Beach boats are great - I hope the category rocks... Obviously failing all other points of difference, the custom colour option secured my order for D-Zero, however I firmly believe cooperation and collective events will be the future... Once the owners take control that is.
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