The Tasar v the Icon

Originally posted by Punky What's not to like about the jib zip Graeme?  Its way better than shanks or a luff wire IMO.

It will break, zips always do and then where are you? Then there's the lack of a pulley block at the top and Wing wang told me to route the halyard back down the jib luff and through that little pulley at the bottom.

Maybe it's me but every boat I've had uses enormous lead edge jib tension, Jib sag is a killer, that leading edge needs to be knife sharp, there's nowhere near enough purchase to get the sort of entry I like with the jib, call me picky but I think that needs sorting with a different approach.

Edit, it's also actually attached at the head to the forestay, so you don't get the differential between forestay and actual jib tension they are both pretty much the same thing. The forestay is fixed by a snap lock doo dah
so even if you do manage to tension the jib you'll get a bowed forestay, I don't like it.

Edited by iGRF - 25 Jul 14 at 9:49am

I'm sorry tick, I've gone a long way already to compromise my hard core surfy,snowboardy skater boy, biker kiter image to do this sitting down nonsense and it may be that the new boardies I had on last night could have contributed, but I call an absolute halt at any thought of sewing a beer mat to my butt.

Now, some credit here has to go to the crew, John Shillyshally from Chipstead it was he who piloted the D zero to third in Sundays race despite having 'previous' in Enterprizes, we've had him in the wood decontamination room being thrashed by birch twigs until he admits his guilt. Anyway he knew what to do with that pole thing and correctly applied it whilst I used my helming genius to keep us as lined up with the shifts as possible off wind and not being blatted or death rolled over by them, and that was a close run thing I can tell you.

My booties are worn to perfection they are at that stage in their life when the grip is at it's best, better than bare foot, I even got stung by a nettle on wednesday they are that thin, so cannot be blamed, it's probably release agent, and the sea is a bit more slippy than fresh water at different times of the year, so it could also be that, there are stacks of jelly fish about, maybe one got in to attack us, maybe the Merlin boys gave us a bit of a spray with sun tan lotion, I wouldn't put it past them, come to think of it I saw mark in the changing room using some ghey spray on factor 50.

Either way it was as slippy as a slippy thing and I'm all over the place and deeply unsettled, I even discussed going over procedure with John before we started I was that convinced we were headed for a swim.

But we managed it, which does kind of suggest it's quick, a couple of new bods fumbling about still managing to beat the boys, and they are no slouch those two, they don't hang about, they absolutely killed it at the start beat us to a pulp, but luckily there were shifts and tide to work which helped even the score and we did manage to round first and a really nice gust saw us sprint on the first leg to gain two or three hundred yards which it took them two roundings to haul us back in on the off wind legs thanks to the kite.

Had we finished at the bottom instead of the top they would have had it, so it's Icon upwind and Merlin off wind which was pretty much how we'd called it before we started and a very enjoyable race it was, I'm stiff as a board this morning, hell there was one tack I had to say to John, 'There's absolutely no reason to tack, this is the best heading, we're being lifted, got the tide on the lee bow and there's plenty of pressure, but I've got to tack off, it's hurting too much..
And they got us on that one.

Edited by iGRF - 25 Jul 14 at 8:58am

"Ice rink"

Well we had a right battle royale tonight, now bear In mind I'm in a new boat with a new guy I'd never sailed with, a new member down from Chipstead. I'm going to start with all the bad things and there are loads of them. For starters what is it with that zip jib system that's knaff, I couldn't get anywhere near enough jib entry tension, not happy with that, in fact the whole jib is the boats weak point imv but more of that later.
Then there's the 'slippy' factor, I'm sliding around like a bar of soap on an ice rink, I swear to God wing wang's tipped her suntan lotion all over everything, or there's still release agent, my splitties are in their super grippy phase but even they were skating about the floor and the none slip - it aint.
Then putting it together, the muppets have left a frayed end on the main sheet that had to be sorted, and I wasn't quite sure how to rig that sheeting system, but cobbled something together, it's rear sheeted, but with just one block on the boom and another on the floor, nowhere to cleat it which made tacking for someone who's used to dropping the sheet in the cleat to change hands, very difficult without the spinning about doing a triple salko on the ice rink as you go through.
We managed to cope with the crew taking the sheet to ensure we got sheeted in quick enough, but fumbled about at the start and ended up second rank, after the b**tards tried to luff us over and we had to duck down under them. I hate the kicker being where it is and having to operate it left handed on Port, this off boom crap, I'm not loving it at all.

Now having said all that and in tricky North Easterly gusty sh*tty wind with a bit of a tide racing, we managed to hold off the Merlin, they got by us a couple of times on the down wind leg, with their kite, but we managed to hunt a couple of better shifts upwind and clawed the lead back to finish a few boat lengths ahead after a very enjoyable and very knackering battle, I'm having to have a bit of a lie down whilst writing this.

It's a surprisingly lively boat, something compared to the Alto you feel on the Edge with, if it's not the fear of death rolling on the down wind leg running the dangly pole by the lee, or the rolling up on a tight reach in the gusts. (We're collectively 142 kgs a tad on the light side).

The course was two broad reach/runs and a tight 2nd reach on the triangle, so they had the off wind advantage with their kite and reeled us in when the wind lulled. We had a couple of moments when the acceleration kicked in, she does go when she gets her tail up, I was probably stood too far back most of the time, sailing a bit defensively, new boat and all that, but once over the hump of a wave, that slicey nose cuts deep and stops you dead, so some running up and down is needed, but not until the slippery surface is dealt with.

She's very sensitive to balance that jib, it's very easy to get wrong and we were playing with it a lot, but it's easy to feel when you're starving it by over sheeting, I didn't mess with the barbara things, i think maybe we should have them back a bit if you're crewing in gusty stuff you do tend to hang on to the sheet and naturally over sheet and being light stuffing it is a defensive move in the gusts, but if you keep an eye on the main which does get backed by the jib, you get the power on and it doesn't seem to me to be a boat that likes to be stuffed and heeled, it works better when it's flat. having said that a couple of times we heeled it and got the tide on the lee bow and took ten boat lengths out of the Merlin riding the inside of a lift and the right side of the tide, so I'm not totally certain, one race aint enough to call it, but I got in it, with a new crew and finished first over the water, so it can't be all that bad can it?
Imagine what someone good and heavier could have done, if the Merlin truly is 990 then we sailed it to 989.

Not enough to take the Laser of course and at 969 we finished third once the spreadsheet had cut in.

I'm looking forward to another go.

After I've waxed it of course.

Edited by iGRF - 24 Jul 14 at 11:09pm

Do they come with disposable ones for when the wind picks up?

Not quite ..... We did consider 'industrial grade' velcro but opted in the end for polysulhide mastic.  Anyway - no holes in hull / deck mounding are required and it can be removed with a bit of time and care.  The standard advise Cirus  gives prospective owners is try it 'without' for a few weeks knowing that you can easily fit one later if you feel the need.

We emulated the way most modern NS14s were run in some of the early prototype work - and decided, at least for us, that their approach (without) offered advantages once you got to understand the boat.   It all depends on what you have sailed previously or prefer.   I think maybe 50% will opt for a conventional thwart in the boat but 2/3rds plus will learn and adapt to 'off the boom sheeting' .... All this really is your choice.

Mike L.

PS - I forgot about the Graduate - Oops !    Perhaps the Firefly and Tasar could usefully run experiments / trials with the dangly - not much to lose and quite lot to gain imo.  Might be a bit more of challenge with a rotating mast though on the Tasar.   Dangle poles can be very inexpensive and retrofitted easily enough.