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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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    Posted: 27 Sep 12 at 2:48pm
If you were to be asked purely on ease of handling, not on difficulty of doing very well, how would you grade the dinghies you have experience of on a 1 to 10 scale, with say the Laser as a Standard set in the middle at 5?

The question came up on American Psycho Anarchy recently.

I made a tentative suggestion that an MPS might be 2, a Contender 3, a Streaker/Solo (not that I've ever been in one) 8/9 and a Phantom 10. Is there anything easier to use than a Phantom? (not that I've been in one of them either)

Anyway you get my gist.

So where would you position relative to a Laser in terms of ease of handling, other boats?
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pondmonkey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pondmonkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 12 at 3:08pm
I'd like to see you gybe a Phant in a F5 and come up the other side saying 'that was easy handling'.... National Championships have been won with expert seamanship known as the 'chicken gybe'.

if you're limiting to singlehanders, then the easiest would have to be one of the softer RS boats- maybe the Q'Ba, though I've not sailed one myself, but the Vareo was pretty docile, even with a kite, and the Q'Ba targeted at a fresher market than that.  We have adult learners in Picos too... they seem quite happy not to go over straight away.  

Most difficult?  Probably the RS600 out of all I've owned.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 12 at 3:29pm
Good question, but 'easy' to handle is not the same thing as 'wonderful' to handle. And what do you mean by handle - gybing and roll tacking, or not tipping over in gusts?

Waterline width and a low centre of gravity and key to reducing twitchiness, but one persons twitchy is another persons 'responsive' with good feedback. It is my opinion that the metacentric height http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metacentric_height is an under-appreciated thing in dinghies. I've been estimating and researching values for some dinghies, and think that there probably is an optimum value for racing dinghies, which is neither big nor small, but somewhere in the middle.

Then of course, there are a myriad other things like does the rig yield nicely (a topic in its own right), height under the boom, how easy the toe straps are to locate, what sort of sheeting arrangement there is, do the foils stall, etc, etc...

Personally, I remember trying a Byte (tin rig version) when I sailed Toppers and thought it was horribly over responsive. Don't know if I'd think that way now, but based on that distant memory I'd score the Byte at about a 2. The Blaze is much more stable than a Laser, but it is much slower to tack (maybe I just don't have the right technique).
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Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 12 at 4:59pm
Originally posted by Peaky


Personally, I remember trying a Byte (tin rig version) when I sailed Toppers and thought it was horribly over responsive. Don't know if I'd think that way now, but based on that distant memory I'd score the Byte at about a 2. The Blaze is much more stable than a Laser, but it is much slower to tack (maybe I just don't have the right technique).

Nothing wrong with your technique Peaky, the Blaze is much slower to tack than a Laser but also far more comfy going upwind when it is windy....

I used to love cruising past sat out on the rack watching the Laser fleet grimacing (I started 3 minutes behind them in a different start). Then when it gets really windy just blowing them off the water!

the only thing I did not like so much was the fact that being relatively high up you didn't get the same sensation of speed as you do in a Laser. A small price to pay though.
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 12 at 5:39pm
Many years ago, when the Blaze first came out, I went up to Datchet and had a test sail of Blaze and Byte. It was horribly gusty, and I must have put the Byte in 1/2 a dozen times. The Blaze, despite being more powerful, and having the original fully battened sail, was much more forgiving.

However, does that mean I'd put the Byte as a harder boat to sail on GRF's list? I don't think so. I'd probably put the Blaze as a 4 and the Byte as a 6.

Other than that - Lightning, 6, Minisail 7, Tera 10, Vareo 4, British Moth 7, Firefly 8, Laser EPS 4, Mirror 15, Prout Puffin 2 (like trying to make a coracle sail upwind...), RS800 -7.

Of course, the fact that I have sailed Fireflies all my life and an RS800 twice on holiday might have something to do with my gradings! Well, and that one of them is very silly.


Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Post Options Post Options   Quote rogerd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 12 at 7:09pm
I wouldnt say the firefly was silly Rupert
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Kev M View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Kev M Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 12 at 9:09am

The Blaze is wonderful in a gale, but painful and difficult to use in a F2 (IMO).  You can't get the transom out of the water (a la Phantom) without standing on the bow, you can't roll tack it, it's difficult to heel to windward or leeward to without digging a rack in, when you hit a wind hole you're so far out from the centre line you need cat-like reflexes to get back in the middle and prevent a backwards roll into the water.

I can forgive all that though for those rare days when it's blowing a hooly.  Definitely scores somewhere around a 3-4 for ease of handling in my opinion.

Successfully confusing ambition with ability since 1980.
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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote G.R.F. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 12 at 10:03am
Originally posted by pondmonkey

I'd like to see you gybe a Phant in a F5 

Huh? I've seen it, watched it done, followed it through the gybe, it goes something like this....

Look up from Mail on Sunday womens section, notice one of those annoying fluro red things that clash so badly with the surroundings is coming up, brush hair out of eyes (salt water is so bad for the hair), put coffee cup back into the holder noting it needs to be moved a bit closer, having to lean forward is so unnecessary, pull the wiggle stick thing towards you whilst shuffling off the comfortable seating bit, undo that pretty bit of coloured rope that holds the boom thing down, keep pulling the wiggle thing until the pointy end has gone round the fluro thing, suffer the absolute inconvenience of having to duck head as that annoying sail & boom conglomeration crashes over, whilst tending to change over to the other side and have to sit on cold wet deck, then remember you left your coffee and mail on the other side, so glare at someone, mouth an obscenity, pull that coloured rope on again, carry on hoping you get to the next fluro thing before it gets cold and the pages get all splashed and wet.

Have I missed anything?

Actually if we're marking boats out of ten for ease of handling then a Phantom is 11. It's so easy clinically obese people favour it.. Wink


Edited by G.R.F. - 28 Sep 12 at 10:07am
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pondmonkey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote pondmonkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 12 at 10:17am
A bit like this Graeme?


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G.R.F. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote G.R.F. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Sep 12 at 10:25am
Clearly they're drunk, they do that Phantom sailors, drink, it's because of the boredom..

And they eat big cakes and pies, I've seen them do it, even in the middle of the morning at the Dinghy show.. comfort eating, none of them are all there really which is why the boat is so eminently suitable for my pal, he's not all there either.


Edited by G.R.F. - 28 Sep 12 at 10:28am
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