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Sailor Trainer? |
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 Topic: Sailor Trainer?Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 9:17am |
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So, we've managed to get a small lottery grant at our club and have some
cash to spend on training boats for newcomers, what's the general consensus? We have a bunch of old toppers that are way past their sell by date and some sort of double hander might be better. Now bear in mind we sail from a gnarly shingle beach with what can get up to be an 'orrible shorebreak in literally minutes whilst you're out there. So it needs to be something newbies can ram up the beach if caught out by a freshening breeze. I've managed to work out on my own that a fleet of MPS's aint ideal, so what's the collective forum advice on the subject? Edited by G.R.F |
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MpHarris
Posting king 
Joined: 09 Jun 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 141 |
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Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 9:42am |
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Something like a vago or rs vision is what the clubs around us seem to have. Either that or a way(barge)fairer is i virtual tank so would take a lot of punishment, plus its big enough to carry quite a few people although its quite heavy . . . |
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Cherub 2663 "Sweet Dreams"
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Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 9:53am |
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The other caveat, we want to teach them to race, we're a racing club after all
and dont have a lot of room in the boat park for none racers to just store their hulks for sunny day sailing. |
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Guest
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Joined: 21 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 0 |
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Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 10:05am |
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How do you plan to allocate this boat and run it ...? We have club loan boats and they seem to create a lot of work. I'd rather invest the budget in programmes to bring people on who have made a commitment and brought a boat sailed by others at the club to assist in class racing, or filter them into the club as crews.
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tack'ho
Really should get out more 
Joined: 08 Feb 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1100 |
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Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 10:22am |
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For training kids I'd be looking at one double hander and a refreshed fleet of toppers. Kids love to compete against each other and we find the quickest way to get them doing that is in single handers. With a steep shingle beach toppers are light enough for 3 or 4 people to run in and grab (in fact you probably already know that, having a fleet! |
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I might be sailing it, but it's still sh**e!
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Simon Lovesey
Far too distracted from work 
Joined: 30 Nov 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 349 |
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Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 10:31am |
I think Rick has a good point, I have seen activity at some clubs actually decline in the long term, once the initial enthusiasm of the new loan fleet has passed. The club boats at our local club are now used infrequently. It would appear those who borrow a loan boat are less likely to get involved in racing and help with running the club. Those who have made a commitment and invested in a boat are more likely to make the effort to use their purchase. I do think there is a role for loan boats to allow newcomers to try before buying, but effort should be made to move them onto their own boat as soon as they are showing long term interest. |
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English Dave
Really should get out more
Joined: 10 Aug 06 Location: Northern Ireland Online Status: Offline Posts: 682 |
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Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 10:53am |
I'd stay away from the Vago if you are teaching complete newbies. Dragging a Wayfarer up a beach will require a lot of manpower/elephants. Also not the best boat for letting newbies loose in unsupervised. If you are in that market you may be better going for the Vision. If buying new then consider the RS Vision/Laser Bahia/Topper Omega. Tough boats that are modern enough to appeal but simple enough to sail. If you are looking at younger sailors then a Topaz might be worth a look. If dragging over shingle is your only option then rotomoulded has got to be a better option than GRP. Different circumstances, I know as we have a slipway launching only, but we have only just recently retired a fleet (6) of Laser2s. Their long daggerboards count against them for beaches as it may be difficult to beat the shorebreak when launching in an onshore breeze. We took the spinnaker and trapeze stuff off them and the mainsails were modded locally to add reefing points and yellow/blue pannels at the head. This meant that they could be used for team racing. The boats were old when we got them and they lasted for about 4 years before we moved them on to concentrate on Picos (most of our beginners are kids and Picos can be sailed 1 or 2 up). I'm not necessarily suggesting Laser2s for your club, just saying that a boat that wouldn't normally be considered a "trainer" worked well for us. It meant that beginners could race each other in near identical boats that were a lot "racier" than a traditional trainer. And that we had enough money to buy 6 old boats rather than 2 new boats. Just a thought.
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Ross
Really should get out more
Joined: 02 May 07 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1163 |
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Posted: 18 Sep 07 at 12:46pm |
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I would use Pico's over Toppers any day. Theres the option for a double hander, so the more experienced kids can take out the little ones for ride. I've taken kids out and it's provided the perfect platform to teach center main tacking/gybing techniques. With a topper you don't have that option. I don't know if toppers come standard with center main or not, Pico's do. Kids seem to like the Pico more than the Topper anyway.
I think adults learning to sail are far more hesitant than a younger people/kids. Because of this, I would look into boats where you can take several of them out at once and then they can progress into single handers. The Laser Stratos, Bahia or the RS Vision would be good for this, but are heavy and would be difficult to drag up a beach. I would be leaning towards the RS though at it looks like its has the most space, tidiest/neatest layout, and its the lightest. After they learn to sail both adults and kids will look for something more challenging/quicker etc. Lasers are good for this as they have the 3 different rigs available and I can guarantee you have laser sailors at your club. This gives them small fleet racing as well as other sailors to give them help and advise on and off the water. If they want to sail double handers, it's much more difficult choice to make. I would suggest, being a racing club, that you look at what double handers are sailed. Laser 2000's, RS 200's, RS Feva's (for kids and teens), RS 500's, Laser Vago's jump to mind as being good club racers and easy to sail. Personally, I would steer clear of Topper. I've never had a good time sailing any of there boats apart from the original Topper. Every sailing centre I have been to that has had topper boats have had bits falling off them, shrouds pulling through the deck etc. You don't need that. Most clubs/centres seem have RS200's and Laser 2000's. |
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Ross
If you can't carry it, don't sail it! |
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) As for the double hander bit of a quandry, plastic boats can take a beating but are heavy to haul up a beach. There have been lots of comments on most of the potentials so I'd trawl through the posts to have a look.|
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